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#101548 - 10/04/12 03:39 PM Re: DIY'ers: Areas, Goals, Concerns, and Progress [Re: iLikeDIY]
Danika Offline
Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 01/06/12
Posts: 476
Thanks so much for the response ilikeDIY. I suppose I need to search this forum so I dont ruin this thread with newbie questions! I just got excited by what i was reading here.
To be clear, it is NOT just this thread that is making me think about learning the craft. I also have NO one here, am totally frustrated by the lack of professionals in my area, and have been considering learning for a while.
I am a very focused,detailed, patient person, and have become gifted, (received international awards even !) at a few difficult technical crafts that i taught myself for the same reasons. Im just unsure of how to go about it so I appreciate your responses.
_________________________
Female- Light skin, brown/blonde hair.
LASER- over 1+yr. Pleasantly surprised with results. No future sessions. Need to live with/in sun.
ELECTROLYSIS- Scammed by the one in my town. Whenever possible, while traveling out of town,I try to get electrolysis on face. Very Challenging overall due to lack of professionals available .Many treatments done on only a tiny area of my face yet there still seems to be alot of hair growing there. Seems an impossible dream at this point frown




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#101552 - 10/05/12 12:47 AM Re: DIY'ers: Areas, Goals, Concerns, and Progress [Re: Danika]
Mantaray Offline
Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 08/23/04
Posts: 711
Loc: San Diego, California
Hey All smile

Hey Danika, sounds like you're kind of distant from resources. I saw a post of yours asking about DVD's, VHS's, and books. If you wanted to get started, here's my concerns: what areas do you want to do? Because I think you mentioned face. That is an extremely tough area to DIY. There was a pro on here once that went on about about how difficult it was when she tried to DIY her own face. I would barely try that now with my years of experience. With DIY, "knowing" how to do electrolysis isn't like a blanket term. I first learned on my front thighs, but at the time would never have been able to do bellybutton or upperchest, that comes in degrees. And I would say, the most advanced DIY is working with a mirror on your own face. That's risky and difficult.

If you want to do things like legs or hands, then thats probably do-able for you. But you have to be really driven to succeed, because the learning curve doesn't happen too quickly. Your brain has to rewire for the small, accurate movements, and it does eventually.

Personally, if I were you, I would do it. I would first buy one of Mike Bono's books, and read the whole thing through. I read it cover to cover in the space of a week before I even turned on my machine. After you get the book down, then you can get a clearer picture of equipment you'll need. This prevents buying things you soon replace, like I did incessantly. After reading the book, You can then go get some 3x reading glasses and buy a pack of cheap ballet 'number 3' needles from Texas Electrolysis Supply, or ask one of us to send you a few. Tape one to a small pencil or stick, and practice insertions under a bright lamp.

All this will cost you about $35 dollars and once you determine if you have capacity to do an insertion, you will know. That's what I recommend: book, insertions, decide.

As for videos, I do have an old VHS video it's called "Thermolysis: Presented by: Electrolysis Research Corp. lecturer James E. Schuster, M.D." I watched it once, I kept falling asleep. He will never, ever, ever win an Academy Award. It was only so-so helpful. Could I have learned without it? Most definitely. If you can't get a video, just pay an electrologist to workd on your forearm for the bare minimum time she will allow. Watch her closely. Once you see it done, you won't forget, and it's the same as the video. I should put up a video on YouTube. I just thought of that now, and I could probably do it well. But the magnification for the camera would be an issue.

Anyway, about getting started in DIY. The one big expenditure is with Loupes. You need good vision, and they may not be so re-sellable. Now the machine you buy, considering it is working and a desired model, can always be resold for what you bought it for if it doesn't work out. So don't think of it as a such a lost investment.

I can't answer all of your questions with just one post, but can address them when able. Let me know.

iLike DIY:
http://www.texaselectrolysissupply.com/
But you have to ask on the phone, last I recall, the Henry Schein's aren't listed on the site. They have some new brand, that's probably just as good. I just don't like the plastic handle ones, I have some and only used one. I keep them around for who knows what.

...Okay, now for fun stuff grin
Last night for two hours, I:

1) cleaned up upper chest. I'm thankful the nipple areas are clearing. Those can be difficult hairs as they can sweep to the side after going below the surface. I kind of tug on them gently to see which way the skin moves to get an idea. Then I do really slow, careful insertions. With nipple hairs, hairs around the bellybutton, or hairs on the tops of the toes, I have found slow, very careful insertions pay for themselves over time. If missed, it'll just keep coming back until one gets it right. Uhh.. kind of like reincarnation I guess.

2) Cleared abdomen on the left side. My main concern there is treatment density so I'll pass up hairs to spread out the work. It's going absolutely great, but I'm finding four days growth is too long. Those hairs being constantly graded by wearing a shirt, tend to distort their angles pretty early after clearing the surface of the skin. My most common tendency to avoid is coming in too steep.

Actually, I should mention, the abdomen is no ordinary area of treatment for me. This area has been through waxing, plucking, rotary epilation, and five laser/microwave treatments. So, these follicles are among the most distorted and messed up anyone will ever see. Thank goodness I have naturally straight hair, or it would be worse. This area, I would imagine is usually pretty uniform on most straight haired people. Not on me. There's lots of depth changes and angle changes (off the surface, not grain), and Lots of these two-hairs growing simultaneously out of one follicle-type situations. Also, lots of follicles that have sharp-angled bends in them that are tough to find the true bottom.

3) And lastly, lower abdomen/ upper pelvis. This is a fun area, and I'm saving it for last of the abdomen/chest work. It's just so easy, all these big, dark hairs at uniform angles and depths, and at a perfect focal working distance just by looking downwards. I wish all areas were this easy. They come out like tree trunks. I'm hitting each a minimum of three times. I only worry about incomplete death here, because this area could yield some ingrowns because of the natural shallow angles.

That's it for today's post. Hope you're all staying on it, getting better with each session. Try watching "Dawn of the Dead" while you're working. There's screaming every 2 minutes in that movie and it just goes along with the zaps so comically ! LOL. Just something I noticed the other day.

Take Care
Mantaray

_________________________
Mantaray

Electrolysis, since 1875

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#101557 - 10/05/12 01:52 AM Re: DIY'ers: Areas, Goals, Concerns, and Progress [Re: Mantaray]
Danika Offline
Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 01/06/12
Posts: 476
HEY MANTARAY!!! THANK YOU SOOOO MUCH FOR SUCH AN INFORMATIVE POST!
Yes it is my face that really needs the work , and there is noone where I live but I would not study electrlys. to do my face for the reasons you mentioned! But as soon as I am able I will take up all of your wise advice and I really appreciate the road map. I WOULD LOVE IF you posted a youtube video!! Please let us know if you do! That would be so helpful and likely more worth of an academy award than the super boring one you slept through!
_________________________
Female- Light skin, brown/blonde hair.
LASER- over 1+yr. Pleasantly surprised with results. No future sessions. Need to live with/in sun.
ELECTROLYSIS- Scammed by the one in my town. Whenever possible, while traveling out of town,I try to get electrolysis on face. Very Challenging overall due to lack of professionals available .Many treatments done on only a tiny area of my face yet there still seems to be alot of hair growing there. Seems an impossible dream at this point frown




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#101561 - 10/05/12 08:40 AM Re: DIY'ers: Areas, Goals, Concerns, and Progress [Re: Mantaray]
ekade Offline
Top 20 Contributor

Registered: 02/14/10
Posts: 306
Originally Posted By: Mantaray
Hey All :)This area has been through waxing, plucking, rotary epilation, and five laser/microwave treatments.

Laser was a total failure?

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#101562 - 10/05/12 08:34 PM Re: DIY'ers: Areas, Goals, Concerns, and Progress [Re: ekade]
Mantaray Offline
Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 08/23/04
Posts: 711
Loc: San Diego, California
Hey ekade,

Yeah, when all that hype was going on a few years back I guess I drank the Kool Aid too.

It was a state of the art laser, on the highest settings bearable, and it didn't do squat. And I have lighter skin and jet-black hair. I remember the operator saying, 'You have the highest pain tolerance I've seen. If there's hair there, it'll be gone.' ...yeah, right.

My posts in the archives follow it. The whole arc, from blind optimism to disillusionment. What a waste of money, hindsights 20/20. You know what kind of electrolysis machine I could've bought with the $2,500 - $3,000 I threw away?

Well, I did get something for my money, induced hair thickness on the side-abdomen area, distorted follicles, a few arc-burn scars on the insteps of my feet, and the worse, a weird skin condition about five inches to the left of my bellybutton that took years to go away (?)(destroyed capillary beds). Like a bruise. I mention it back in the archives somewhere.

But honestly, mix in the rotary epilator use, aggressive plucking, and waxing, and who can say what? Its just an area where the follicles need to be put out of their misery. Its such a relief to finally clear the area quickly. I think I had a mental block with this area for the longest time, dreading the work due to all my past experiences. Doing it, its not so bad and clearing quick.

Mantaray


The orange choice on the color selection isn't orange enough. I'm an orange freak, I know my orange.
_________________________
Mantaray

Electrolysis, since 1875

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#101564 - 10/05/12 09:34 PM Re: DIY'ers: Areas, Goals, Concerns, and Progress [Re: Mantaray]
Michael Bono Online

Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 01/11/11
Posts: 3184
Loc: Santa Barbara, CA USA
Direct quote from a laser ad:

“[Purchase a 6-month package and] ... after the sixth treatment is completed, if you are not fully satisfied with your results, you are guaranteed to receive up to 4 additional Laser Hair Removal treatments in the same body area as the original purchase over the next 12 months.”

So, what happens after the last treatment, if the thing didn’t work at all? What happens if you get MORE hair growth caused by the laser? Frankly, we need to have a sharp attorney write up a “Patient’s Agreement” that can be handed to the laser tech and signed by them. Right now, the game is stacked against the patient.

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#101569 - 10/06/12 12:07 AM Re: DIY'ers: Areas, Goals, Concerns, and Progress [Re: Michael Bono]
Mantaray Offline
Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 08/23/04
Posts: 711
Loc: San Diego, California
Hey Mike!

Yeah, I remember signing all these forms before the five treatments that, just the opposite, took all my rights away.

I had really, really mulled a lawsuit against him for the scar on my instep (rt. foot) and the capillary bed/bruise-thing. It was shaped like a peanut. It stayed for at least three years, and is still discolored. I even went as far as doing a background check on him. It turned up some pretty amazing things resulted in him getting his MD suspended. He was formerly an OB/GYN, and went into aesthetic medicine after a big lawsuit kind of chased him out of that.

This is his site:
http://www.sdbodyimaging.com/

This is something about him:
http://realchoice.0catch.com/library/weekly/aa061101d.htm
...yeah, lucky me. Look who I got as my laser operator.

I can't believe he's still using the Elos light/RF laser.
That thing kicks out RF/microwaves to heat your skin with radiation, apparently to assist in the effectiveness of the laser. What it does is boil the blood, and explode the capillary beds, causing the deep bruising/death of the skin if it gets too hot. Which it did on me.

As for the foot burns, that was caused by the two electrodes that emit the RF coming in focused (not spread out, flush) contact with the surface being treated. He should have known that it would occur on the variable surface of the foot's instep. It would be difficult to keep it flush there. I remember the sound, burn smell, and pain of the RF arc. It hurt!

I passed on any lawsuit. Anybody who's been in a lengthy lawsuit knows the toll they take on you. Not worth it. But I had at one time all the photos and third party MD opinions ready.

Anyway, live and learn. Would they acknowledge a contract being presented to them to sign? Probably not. The AMA, or whover regulates them would have to institute it. Their lobby would fight it.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Hey Mike I got to get to your website to get your two-hand literature you mentioned. Hope you guys are good up there in Northern Cal. My most excellent electrolysis pros Wendy Golden and Rochelle Kimberling down here in San Diego really praised you.

Mantaray

btw: If I got 12 more months of the Elos laser because of dissatisfaction, I might not've been alive to post this! smile
_________________________
Mantaray

Electrolysis, since 1875

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#101570 - 10/06/12 01:30 AM Re: DIY'ers: Areas, Goals, Concerns, and Progress [Re: Mantaray]
Michael Bono Online

Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 01/11/11
Posts: 3184
Loc: Santa Barbara, CA USA
If your case is still withing "statues of limitations" I do have a lawyer that will take your case and take an appropriate percentage. If you were injured you should seek "damages."

So far this guy has gotten money back for many "cosmetic procedures" that didn't work, or worse injured the patient. Let me know if you wish to do this. Yes, cases like this can take years to resolve, but if you aren't paying the lawyer does all the work.

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#101571 - 10/06/12 03:02 AM Re: DIY'ers: Areas, Goals, Concerns, and Progress [Re: Michael Bono]
Danika Offline
Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 01/06/12
Posts: 476
Very nice offer Michael! And Mantaray, maybe with justice on your side you can get your money back and buy that electrolysis machine you really wanted!

((PS. ON A SIDE TOPIC what would be the chance that a small group of keen, kind and grateful DIYers could hire you Michael to host a small course for us? As in a few days of private instruction, advice ? That would be my greatest wish ! ))

Ok back to the real world of lawyers and nasty lying doctors ;)0)
_________________________
Female- Light skin, brown/blonde hair.
LASER- over 1+yr. Pleasantly surprised with results. No future sessions. Need to live with/in sun.
ELECTROLYSIS- Scammed by the one in my town. Whenever possible, while traveling out of town,I try to get electrolysis on face. Very Challenging overall due to lack of professionals available .Many treatments done on only a tiny area of my face yet there still seems to be alot of hair growing there. Seems an impossible dream at this point frown




Top
#101573 - 10/06/12 01:16 PM Re: DIY'ers: Areas, Goals, Concerns, and Progress [Re: Danika]
ekade Offline
Top 20 Contributor

Registered: 02/14/10
Posts: 306
Thank you for sharing your laser experience, Mantaray. It seems that you had all side-effects of laser! Really sorry about it.

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