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#121422 - 03/23/16 11:15 PM Re: Challenging Dectro officials [Re: mhawkes]
dfahey Offline

Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 10/27/03
Posts: 9689
Loc: Columbus, Ohio
Originally Posted By mhawkes

Why create a fantastic machine then 'teach' students to puck!! Surely Dectro are not teaching this, when I picked my unit I was given a demo but immediately had to go much higher than with the el's. 45% could get the hair out but the timing would need to be higher to give more el, and displacement may be used this can help with comfort(pain) levels.


I think Dectro does not endorse tweezing. They need to talk to the representatives.

Mairi, I have found the same thing to be true with the presets, but no big deal. Nothing takes the place of thinking and remembering certain effective principles. This is why I laugh when some know-it-all's say that Dectro epilators take the control away from the electrologist. A repeated lie from people that have never touched one. If I start with a pre-set and the hair doesn't budge, I go to up another level and so forth, until I settle on a good energy level. Sometimes I adjust the timing upward or I buzzz up the intensity and decrease the timing. There are so many options to choose from with this unit. I have found the Pro-Tec probes offer more comfort for sensitive clients, but I use all types of brands, depending on the situation.
_________________________
Dee Fahey, R.N., C.T.
Licensed by the State Medical Board of Ohio for Nursing license and Cosmetic Therapy/Electrolysis license
_____________________
ELECTROLYSIS FAQ'S:

British Institute & Association of Electrolysis

http://www.electrolysis.co.uk/?page_id=16

Do not give up, the beginning is always the hardest.

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#121423 - 03/23/16 11:17 PM Re: Challenging Dectro officials [Re: dfahey]
depilacionelectr
Unregistered


Originally Posted By dfahey
Originally Posted By depilacionelectr
Originally Posted By dfahey


Please contact Dectro if you feel so strongly about their erroneous statements. Passionate people should not limit their audience to a website discussion. You can change the world, Adrien by going straight to the "horses"mouth!



I doubt that Adrien be able to change any idea or belief of Dectro's people. In 2007, my friends, the Teruel marriage, visited Dectro facilities in Quebec City. They showed the results of our clinical trial which clearly was showing that the treatment in telogen is as effective as in anagen. Today, 9 years later, their trainers continue with their erroneous beliefs (Except Johanne Fortier, perhaps).

There is no worse blind than the one who do not want to see!




Nothing is in vain, Adrien. That doesn't mean that anagen and resistance issues shouldn't be addressed again. Maybe it will take 9 more years? There is proof on video's that these teaching practices are not agreed on by skilled professionals. Never give up discussing the issues that you are so passionate about. Hairtell is a safe place to do have this discussion, but will it change anything? Sometimes it takes more effort, more than one time to sell your point of view. You of all people can win the day Josefa, but if you do not desire to engage with Dectro anymore, perhaps Adrien could take on the giant. He seems very capable of doing so. At least, that is my suggestion for moving forward to correct bad practices.



I have nothing personal against Dectro, and I'm sure Adrien either. On the contrary, they are the ones who continued to favor our industry, when everyone else left the ship. They took the helm, and so today they are hold a well-deserved leadership position in the market. And if only for this reason, they have a greater share of responsibility as regards academic training.

I knew that training was not very good in my country, not even good, but I could not imagine it was so bad. I'm ashamed, frustrated and quite angry. Dectro must act, and urgently. Spanish (like the rest of mortals) deserve that future professionals are better trained.

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#121424 - 03/23/16 11:36 PM Re: Challenging Dectro officials [Re: adrien_sanchiz]
dfahey Offline

Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 10/27/03
Posts: 9689
Loc: Columbus, Ohio
Of course, I agree, Josefa. They do have a higher calling to promote best evidence-based practices.

This is a very useful thread. Im not sure they will see this discussion. As I said to Adrien, I would be glad to send this link to someone at Dectro, with his permission.

I have heard too many bitch sessions in my lifetime, mainly outside of Hairtell, not related to hair removal, and frankly it is not helpful to complain to anyone other than the one you are upset with. Dectro is not above being asked why these practices are being taught. They have always been very reasonable people. I love the idea of Adrien getting involved. His French is better than mine, so who better to communicate?

By the way Adrien, my favorite French soaps are A La Maison. Rosemary Mint is my favorite. I just ordered the lavender. Beautiful scent! The French know how to make soap.

_________________________
Dee Fahey, R.N., C.T.
Licensed by the State Medical Board of Ohio for Nursing license and Cosmetic Therapy/Electrolysis license
_____________________
ELECTROLYSIS FAQ'S:

British Institute & Association of Electrolysis

http://www.electrolysis.co.uk/?page_id=16

Do not give up, the beginning is always the hardest.

Top
#121427 - 03/24/16 12:05 AM Re: Challenging Dectro officials [Re: dfahey]
depilacionelectr
Unregistered


Adrien has seen the degree of confusion in which his classmates are involved. On the one hand, the reference book says that the hairs can be treated successfully at any stage, and the hair should never be forced out.
Moreover, teachers say: "A telogen follicle can only be dilated because of dehydration, so you have to exert traction".

Are we stupid or what? how many times we have to prove that a telogen hair is removed with the same ease and smoothness that an anagen? how many demo videos more needs to be done? how many pictures showing evidence of results in telogen are needed?

I do not know, Dee, Adrien's enthusiasm is very familiar to me, his passion, his dedication, his projects. I just hope he has more success I had. He knows he has my full support.

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#121428 - 03/24/16 12:54 AM Re: Challenging Dectro officials [Re: adrien_sanchiz]
dfahey Offline

Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 10/27/03
Posts: 9689
Loc: Columbus, Ohio
Adrien is very special, indeed. I've been observing him for awhile and he is up to the task, I'm sure. He should be the Dectro representative in France and perhaps he will be if he involves Dectro in his passion for excellent electrolysis care. You, too, Jos, have put your heart into educating the public and the professionals, so you get heaps of praise for that effort.

In every profession, there is this back and forth concerning the "science" of it all!
These tugs of war over terms and evidence-based practices are ongoing. It can take a lot of time and effort to change hearts.

I was never trained by Dectro . I did attend their seminar in Quebec City in 2011. I give them tons of praise for their classy, energetic agenda when I was there. They roll out the red carpet for the attendee's. I don't recall hearing anything about it being okay to tug at hairs. In fact, they offered helpful strategies to get smooth releases on those pesky small white grain of salt hairs from the cheek area, especially. Those can be real BEE- OCHES, as you know. So, what Adrien recorded was probably individual instructor related, to which Dectro gives wide latitude to express what they think is true. There are differing thoughts in all professions and the best way to have everybody in sync with information, is to keep discussing, to convince, or to change hearts, if you will. There is always work to be done.

A practicing electrologist is OBLIGATED to continue their education beyond their school, outdated books or what the electrologist on the other side of town says. That is why Hairtell, HairShoot and Electrology International are very valuable resources for the profession, though I hear that Hairtell has become boring, weird and less important. This is a consumer site and some professionals get annoyed with answering the same questions over and over again, but the fearful, first time consumer is just looking for a little help, so where do they go? It is all new and scary for them. I try to never forget how the consumer feels.

I would love to hear Dectro's response to this thread, but I feel Hairtell is not the place that they would engage in such a discussion.

_________________________
Dee Fahey, R.N., C.T.
Licensed by the State Medical Board of Ohio for Nursing license and Cosmetic Therapy/Electrolysis license
_____________________
ELECTROLYSIS FAQ'S:

British Institute & Association of Electrolysis

http://www.electrolysis.co.uk/?page_id=16

Do not give up, the beginning is always the hardest.

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#121429 - 03/24/16 07:56 AM Re: Challenging Dectro officials [Re: adrien_sanchiz]
Cihan Yaman
Unregistered


Thanks for opening this discussion.


I was treated summarized eight hours with the apilus xcell and can just sympathized with your criticism.

First, the practitioner couldn't find the right settings even after three hours of playing with her machine.
Second, more than half of the hairs where plucked out and even after telling her this several time, she wasn't able to find a solution.
Third, on a educational basis dectro seems to have severe problems to stay updated and follow the newest progress of electrolysis.

Summarized I was very disappointed and needed to fight afterwards with a huge number of ingrown hairs.

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#121430 - 03/24/16 08:26 AM Re: Challenging Dectro officials [Re: dfahey]
adrien_sanchiz Offline
Top 20 Contributor

Registered: 08/02/13
Posts: 317
Loc: France, Spain
Originally Posted By dfahey


By the way Adrien, my favorite French soaps are A La Maison. Rosemary Mint is my favorite. I just ordered the lavender. Beautiful scent! The French know how to make soap.



I didn't know this brand. I searched a little and found this is an American brand with French inspired recipe. wink
_________________________
Licensed electrologist and esthetician.
http://adrien-sanchiz-electrolysis.blogspot.fr/

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#121431 - 03/24/16 08:29 AM Re: Challenging Dectro officials [Re: adrien_sanchiz]
dfahey Offline

Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 10/27/03
Posts: 9689
Loc: Columbus, Ohio
The epilator used is only as good as the person operating the epilator. I'm sure this is already obvious to you.

This is why I emphasized asking why observations and complaints were not addressed directly to Dectro instructors and beyond. Feedback can result in positive change.

The XCell Pro is an awesome tool. It is not difficult to use. The person in Germany needs to ask for help and not charge a single person while she or he is learning.
_________________________
Dee Fahey, R.N., C.T.
Licensed by the State Medical Board of Ohio for Nursing license and Cosmetic Therapy/Electrolysis license
_____________________
ELECTROLYSIS FAQ'S:

British Institute & Association of Electrolysis

http://www.electrolysis.co.uk/?page_id=16

Do not give up, the beginning is always the hardest.

Top
#121432 - 03/24/16 08:38 AM Re: Challenging Dectro officials [Re: adrien_sanchiz]
dfahey Offline

Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 10/27/03
Posts: 9689
Loc: Columbus, Ohio
Originally Posted By adrien_sanchiz
Originally Posted By dfahey


By the way Adrien, my favorite French soaps are A La Maison. Rosemary Mint is my favorite. I just ordered the lavender. Beautiful scent! The French know how to make soap.



I didn't know this brand. I searched a little and found this is an American brand with French inspired recipe. wink


Oh, shocker! We actually make something here. Yes! It is French inspired and milled. The scent is heavenly! My clients all rave about this soap. I purchased the liquid Rosemary and mint soap and just ordered honeysuckle to check it out.

Now back to the thread. Would you like me to email this link to Dectro? I would never do it without your permission. I'm not sure reading Hairtell is on their list of things that matter.
_________________________
Dee Fahey, R.N., C.T.
Licensed by the State Medical Board of Ohio for Nursing license and Cosmetic Therapy/Electrolysis license
_____________________
ELECTROLYSIS FAQ'S:

British Institute & Association of Electrolysis

http://www.electrolysis.co.uk/?page_id=16

Do not give up, the beginning is always the hardest.

Top
#121433 - 03/24/16 09:52 AM Re: Challenging Dectro officials [Re: adrien_sanchiz]
adrien_sanchiz Offline
Top 20 Contributor

Registered: 08/02/13
Posts: 317
Loc: France, Spain
I agree with you, Dectro designs and manufactures amazing machines that make our work easier . I didn't have the pleasure to work with the xCell machine , but I have been practiced for many hours with one of the Platinum Apilus of Josefa . And I've never done plucking. The results were shown here , a French girl on hairtell shared her testimony with photos.

Dectro has a great video online, where you can see how the hair is treated without resistance. So I wonder , why their European subsidiaries do not try to do the same? I have no objection to share this thread with them. On the contrary, they can not remain indifferent to what happens outside its walls . The hope of many people is at stake.
_________________________
Licensed electrologist and esthetician.
http://adrien-sanchiz-electrolysis.blogspot.fr/

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