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#123057 - 11/18/16 11:20 AM Apilus Platinum Issue?
Iluv2zap Offline
Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 11/19/14
Posts: 1154
I need your help dear readers of hairtell.

Back in March, my boss and I made a day trip to Montreal. It was investment in the future of the clinic time, and we had an ambitious schedule, hoping to check out both some Apilus and Silouette Tone epilators, some saddle seats , and various other needs for our clinic.

We spent most of our day in Montreal at Dectro, comparing side by side the Apilus platinum Pure and the Apilus XCell. At the end of the day we ended up returning to Ottawa with a Platinum Pure in the trunk.Now to be fair, it was on MY recommendation that we went looking at a Platinum Pure in the first place.I had been lead to believe by my experience with my own Apilus SM-500 as well as the discussions here, that it was a superior machine that would serve us for a lot of years.If I could go back in time however, I would take back that recommendation.

Immediately we began to see problems. The epilator seemed to have LOTS of power, but more concerning, we were experiencing problems with current feedback ( what we think may have been DC current). Before even touching the pedal, we could feel discomfort as we inserted a probe into my arm. It seemed okay when my boss worked on my arm, but was painful to work on myself. Worse, it was leaving black scorch marks on my boss's leg.

We called up Dectro and explained our problem. We also explained that the epilator didnt do it at all when my matching sm-500 pedal was used. Now, my pedal is old, but works well, however its possible the grounding shield in the wire is broken. Dectro send us a replacement pedal. The issue seemed somewhat better, but still present.We managed to determine that the feedback current we were feeling, was occurring when we touched the metal grounded ring on the pedal at the same time we inserted the probe. I was a minorish annoyance, but , it wasnt working correctly, however we got by from march until july with this epilator . It seemed to have very strong current. Rarely did we raise the current in synchro above 3 or 4 on the thickest of hairs.

At the start of july, we moved into new offices.2 treatment rooms, and we had the Apilus and the silouette tone VMC working side by side in our 2 treatment rooms. The apilus lived in our largest room.I learned to use the VMC. I am delighted to say, never once has the VMC ever failed.

Just before we moved, the Apilus decided not to make current anymore. We narrowed this down by replacing the probe-holder, which resolved the issue, until we moved into our new offices.

Shortly after moving into our offices, I started to periodically experience inconsistent current with the Platinum. It just didnt FEEL right, accurate imsertions and high power, and one time it might deliver the entire current, or it may give out next to nothing. WE changed probe holders again, but it had no effect. Worse the issue seemed intermittent.We never knew when the problem was occurring, and when it was not.

There's lots more to say in this tale, but as I'm running between home and office this will be a several part post.

Seana
_________________________
Seana Richmond
Certified Electrologist.
Electrolysis By Seana
http://electrolysisbyseana.com

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#123058 - 11/18/16 12:01 PM Re: Apilus Platinum Issue? [Re: Iluv2zap]
Iluv2zap Offline
Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 11/19/14
Posts: 1154
ok, part II.
As mentioned, we seemed to have power consistency problems. We also had some feedback current through the pedal, but working with shoes on corrected this issue. One morning when working on a client the Apilus stopped being able to epilate hairs. same settings as I had used on the same client multiple times. multiple pulses of synchro 4 5 and 6 would not release a cheek hair. Changing channels, or changing probe holders had no effect on the issue. We contacted Dectro as the unit was under warranty. It then cost over $300 for insured shipping to montreal . They had the machine for a few days, couldnt find the problem, shipped it to quebec city, who replaced the pedal, and shipped it back to us saying they could not find the problem.

The very next morning, we again got no current from the Apilus. We contacted Dectro again, and they agreed to replace the unit with one from the Dectro School.

All things being equal, this should be the end of the story right? I wish it was so.

So the first thing we notice about the "new" platinum pure is it isnt as strong as the first one. Energy is at least 1-2 settings lower in power than what we experienced with the first machine. Within a day, the intermittent problem we were seeing
before the machine was exchanged, was back. My boss in fact didnt believe it was so, convincing herself ( and me) that it had to be some issue like moisture in the follicle, insertion depth, something other than a problem with the epilator.

Except, that over time, this issue has haunted us. It seems to work fine on occasion, at other times, complete crap. Teesting on my own arm detected a varience from 0 to full power , sometimes it was clear NO ENERGY had been dispersed from the probe, other times, it seemed fine and consistent.

We began to suspect the problem could be not with the platinum pure but with the power in our office.However if this were the case, we would expect the VMC to also malfunction, but, it's been fine, solid as a rock, and quicklybecoming my preferred epilator for this reason.

Stay tuned, part 3 is on it's way!
_________________________
Seana Richmond
Certified Electrologist.
Electrolysis By Seana
http://electrolysisbyseana.com

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#123061 - 11/18/16 11:02 PM Re: Apilus Platinum Issue? [Re: Iluv2zap]
fenix Offline
Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 03/17/12
Posts: 469
I'm very surprised! If Dectoro headquarters can't solve the problem for you, then God help you. This is the first time I'm hearing of quality issues with Dectro especially the Platinum line. If you have the ability to test out the new Silhouet-Tone Evolution 5D, it supposed to be competition to Platinum and Xcel.

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#123062 - 11/18/16 11:08 PM Re: Apilus Platinum Issue? [Re: Iluv2zap]
EmancipatedElect Offline
Major Contributor

Registered: 07/21/14
Posts: 146
Loc: Rochester, NY
As I've posted in EI, I haven't taken apart my Apilus machine yet, but given the sound mine used to make before I put it on a line conditioning UPS and the symptoms other people have had tracing back to power/circuitry, I suspect Dectro are using cheap power supplies and that is the cause of the issue.

I haven't heard from anyone yet that has their machine on a line conditioning UPS that developed power issues and/or circuit failures. The VMC could just be using a better quality power supply that is correcting the issue before it gets to the circuits.
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Emancipated Electrolysis LLC
Rochester, NY

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#123063 - 11/19/16 12:04 AM Re: Apilus Platinum Issue? [Re: Iluv2zap]
Iluv2zap Offline
Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 11/19/14
Posts: 1154
Well, as I said there is more to the story.
I've been in office and on the go all day, so right now just getting back to the rest.
We did get a UPS, at my urging my boss picked one up at the local best buy. She did not however, get what I would have suggested. You see I did network support for 25 years. I know how UPS's work, why they work the way they do. There are good UPS's and poor ones.
I would classify what arrived in my office as too small, and of unknown power conditioning abilities. A basic battery backup that could handle a scant 600 VA ( about 350 watts more or less) and no mentio of the power conditioning, though it does list surge protection. A good quality UPS should provide a constant current in a sine wave pattern. Less expensive ones will produce perhaps a constant current but not in a sine wave pattern. More sensative electronics can be sensative to this modified wave form.IT can be concluded that a epilator made to medical specifications might be sensative to irregular current.

So, first time I worked with the Apilus after the UPS arrived I started to have problems.I at first realized the machine was on the surge only side of the plugs, and movced it to the battery backup side. Still the same symptoms we have at this point seen for months. Poorer and poorer eneergy. But we also started to realize we were correct about the un-even power in our largest treatment room.The whole time we re working the UPS can be heard going "CLIKC>CLICK" quite loudly. Throughout the treatment sessions, over and over.Something seems to be tripping the automatic circuit breaker in the UPS.
After having trouble I informed my boss ( who at this point was on maternity leave) and she was certain it was working properly. She tested it on her husband, and just like it has consistently it worked to remove his hair. No dropped power.AShe had movcved the machine to our other treatment room, and the UPS, does not trigger the circuit breaker in that room.

We were away for a few days at convention so when we arrived home we tried to use the machine, but it failed yet again. We called up Dectro this week, and they supplied us with replacement power cord , that is medical grade and insulated, at the suggestion of another electrologist from california.Apparently they have seen quite a few platinum pure consistency issues down that way and replacing the cord with the better made one corrected it. Unfortunately, having tried this new cord, both on the UPS and directly in the wall, the machine is operating identically, that is to say, it is failing to produce current.This afternoon I delivered 18 ppulses of synchro -6 arm setting ( 474EL) to a single follicle at varying depth. That hair, did not release.

We've replaced the probe holder. We've replaced the pedal. Weve replaced the power cord itself. We have replaced the whole machine.How is it possible that we have the same issue we starrted with?

I messages with my boss, we've determined short of picking the thing up and bringing it to her house to test it there, there is nothing further we can do.I could have the boss invest $200 in a better quality UPS with sine wave output, but , somehow I dont think it could correct the problem.

Unlike Emancipated however, I AM hearing about power level issues from many owners of the Platinum Pure. After talking it over today, I think we both feel the machine needs to be serviced or replaced by dectro.

What I'm wondering however, is if owners of Xcell epilators are experienceing this kind of issue? I havent heard anyone say that has been an issue.


Gosh it's frustrating.



_________________________
Seana Richmond
Certified Electrologist.
Electrolysis By Seana
http://electrolysisbyseana.com

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#123064 - 11/19/16 05:26 AM Re: Apilus Platinum Issue? [Re: fenix]
beate_r Offline

Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 07/25/05
Posts: 894
Loc: Hattersheim, Germany
Originally Posted By fenix
I'm very surprised! If Dectoro headquarters can't solve the problem for you, then God help you. This is the first time I'm hearing of quality issues with Dectro especially the Platinum line.


It should have been the 2nd time. My first pure also has quality issues. The motherboard died during the warranty time. It was replaced by a motherboard of the "large" Platinum. The distributor needed 3 weeks for the repair, and the could not deliver a replacement device for that time !!!!

If i did not have the old Junior i would have been totally lost. Now it is reliable most of the time, but sometimes it also seems flakey. Notably the relais switching the output seems to have contact problems, and then it is necessary to switch it back and forth several times.

As nice and powerful the machine is, the manufactoring quality and the robustness of my old Junior is way better.

BTW: a member of this board bought a used Apilus Cleo Blend in order to learn electrolysis (from me). After a few months the device was dead; no signal at the output. It looks as if the output stage had died.

And the Xcels? You pay for additional features no one actually needs...
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Beate Ritzert

Elektroepilation Dr. Beate Ritzert
http://epi.ritzert.net/en/

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#123065 - 11/19/16 05:34 AM Re: Apilus Platinum Issue? [Re: Iluv2zap]
beate_r Offline

Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 07/25/05
Posts: 894
Loc: Hattersheim, Germany
Seana: with Your experiences i would invest in an Instantron Elite Spectrum or Spectrum K). Maybe trying to get a device for testing.

The newer Spectrums with a minimum time of 0.1 secs are quite usable (but i would miss a finer time resolution instead of just 0.1, 0.2 and 0.3 secs). Aside of this drawback it nearly reaches the Platinum in power vs pain. The machine is clearly better than my Junior.
_________________________
Beate Ritzert

Elektroepilation Dr. Beate Ritzert
http://epi.ritzert.net/en/

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#123066 - 11/19/16 01:57 PM Re: Apilus Platinum Issue? [Re: Iluv2zap]
EmancipatedElect Offline
Major Contributor

Registered: 07/21/14
Posts: 146
Loc: Rochester, NY
Originally Posted By Iluv2zap
We've replaced the probe holder. We've replaced the pedal. Weve replaced the power cord itself. We have replaced the whole machine.How is it possible that we have the same issue we starrted with?


The capacitors or circuits could have been damaged due to power fluctuations. Back in my computer repair days, I saw it very frequently. Undervolting is more problematic than overvolting since the fuse won't protect against an undervolt, but the undervolt can still damage the circuit... and if you're getting a lot of clicking on the UPS, that is it switching off the input power, indicating there's a problem with it.

Quote:

Unlike Emancipated however, I AM hearing about power level issues from many owners of the Platinum Pure. After talking it over today, I think we both feel the machine needs to be serviced or replaced by dectro.


To clarify, I've heard LOTS of power issues with the platinum, just none from people using the platinum on a line conditioning UPS.

For the cost of one of these machines, the power supply in them should be doing conditioning for us anyway.

Quote:

What I'm wondering however, is if owners of Xcell epilators are experienceing this kind of issue? I havent heard anyone say that has been an issue.


I've heard of the same issues with the Xcell, again, with none of them using a line conditioning UPS.


_________________________
Emancipated Electrolysis LLC
Rochester, NY

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#123067 - 11/19/16 02:18 PM Re: Apilus Platinum Issue? [Re: Iluv2zap]
Iluv2zap Offline
Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 11/19/14
Posts: 1154
well my boss made the smart decision to return the unit. I hope we have nt any issues doing that, but IO agree with the decision. I'm still looking at a machine for me, and the spectrum eleite and the vmc are frontrunners at this time I think. I cant justify 11000 dollars for a machine I think will flake out on me
_________________________
Seana Richmond
Certified Electrologist.
Electrolysis By Seana
http://electrolysisbyseana.com

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#123068 - 11/19/16 03:07 PM Re: Apilus Platinum Issue? [Re: Iluv2zap]
Iluv2zap Offline
Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 11/19/14
Posts: 1154
Beate do you know the approximate price for the spectrum elite?
_________________________
Seana Richmond
Certified Electrologist.
Electrolysis By Seana
http://electrolysisbyseana.com

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