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#125469 - 12/18/17 07:35 PM Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! [Re: SecretSid]
Michael Bono Offline

Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 01/11/11
Posts: 3287
Loc: Santa Barbara, CA USA
I have to agree with you Josefa. See, we might illustrate what we are doing, but we have never told any electrologist that "this is the ONLY way." Indeed, I wrote a book called "the Blend Method" and it does explain the justification and theories behind the blend ... that does NOT therefore mean that I'm against any other modality (and I'm not). Yet, people assume that I am "bull-headed" on the subject.

As we repeat over-and-over there are many strategies. I say, here's one way ... and there are other ways and certainly I follow different strategies all the time. The big cases ... with the big results ... and the ones who follow the most aggressive strategy, get the job done relatively quickly and are the best photographic subjects.

But there is an "instant reaction" ... even from friendly electrologists ... who think if you say something specific, that means you are critical of whatever they are doing (and usually you don't know what they are doing).

If somebody says they use an insulated needle, that doesn't mean that my use of a non-insulated needle is wrong. That's not what they are saying; and that's not what I hear either.

I hope that "Roselake" now sees why most of us just "shut the f... up" and keep to ourselves; or just utter platitudes so as to not "piss off" other operators. It's just not worth it.

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#125471 - 12/18/17 09:35 PM Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! [Re: SecretSid]
Michael Bono Offline

Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 01/11/11
Posts: 3287
Loc: Santa Barbara, CA USA
YES! There is some danger in the "electrolysis zealot" who has found "the holy grail!"

Years ago when I was doing a lot of work in Holland, a woman (Mrs. Rooperos) was so horrible in my lecture I asked her to leave. She was a zealot for some method that she insisted was the best ... she would not let me do my lecture and interrupted me constantly.

Anyway, she listened, got used to what I was teaching and THEN became a gigantic pain in the butt supporting my ideas. She went from one extreme to another, but her "pain in the assness" kept on going. Sometimes clients are like that: they find the "truth" and then everybody else is wrong.

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#125472 - 12/18/17 09:38 PM Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! [Re: SecretSid]
Michael Bono Offline

Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 01/11/11
Posts: 3287
Loc: Santa Barbara, CA USA
There are no laser operators posting here ... and only a couple electrologists. This is a nice site, but it is not an educational site and never purported to be. It's like a gigantic "mixer" that ends in a "black hole." But folks probably get something out of it ... hope so.

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#125491 - 12/21/17 11:08 AM Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! [Re: SecretSid]
adrien_sanchiz Offline
Top 20 Contributor

Registered: 08/02/13
Posts: 306
Loc: France, Spain
Nowadays in beauty industry we tend to provide before and after pictures. Why ? Because beauty industry have a very long history of scams. From radioactive face powder (1930”) to stem cells cream (nowadays).
It is the same for beauty technology : micro-current, galvanic mask lift... and now the new technology with invisible bioestimulation laser, “tsunami wave”....

I think all that stuff is fantastic, it does illustrate how creative we are and how passionate we are for treating and beautifying the skin.

I am currently working for a Spanish company as a trainer for beauty machine and electrolysis.

For our radiofrequency machine we provide pictures from the client himself. Moreover we teach how taking before and after pictures properly in order to be able to judge the results. (I am quite impressed by the radiofrequency technology by the way).

Before and after pictures is the key to convince our clients. We can repeat 1000 times we are the best, our machine is so unique, so powerful... in vain. Nowadays the consumer is more educated, he gets internet, he doesn’t want to get scammed and he is true !
This is the same for FUE surgery (for treating baldness). Now consumers WANT before and after pictures. In this field, for 100 surgeons, we have only 10 which are able to provide good pictures.
Are the others one bad surgeons ? Not at all. But the bad ones are not able to provide good results for sure.

HOWEVER for electrolysis field, it seems that this is all different. Thanks to the fathers of electrolysis (experienced in 1866 and 1875) we know electrolysis can permanently destroy superfluous hair.
The bad news are that these doctors from the 19 century did not take any pictures. Fortunately in theses cases, words was enough.
BUT electrolysis results depend only on the practicionner, not the machine.

Of course that is okay if no one want to take before and after picture, as it used to be in the 19th century. However, how to respond to all these people saying electrolysis does not work?

In French forum, (for example)!the big majority of testimonies says electrolysis does not work. Because they experimented with DOCTORS and they didn’t get results.
How can we convince them ? Saying that in 1866 and 1875 we get some medical littérature telling that it worked at this time ? Or repeating other and other again that the FDA said this is “permanent”? Well, it is what we are doing...

Consumers don’t care about doctors in the 19th century and this American organization called FDA. They want results ! Real results !

Going back to my work: we have pictures for our radiofrequency machine but none for electrolysis... I have mine in case if a client wondering...

Thus why electrolysis escapes to the norm for the beauty industry ? In surgery we have pictures, in plastic surgery we have pictures (more and more in scientific litterature they publish pictures too), in FUE surgery, in aesthetic procedure as Botox, fillers, radiofrequency and LASER we have pictures...

And electrologists, closed on their little world, don’t want to take and publish pictures... moreover they prefer to attack the one who published before and after pictures....

Meanwhile Mike Bono is still wondering in Facebook why people don’t know electrolysis...


Edited by adrien_sanchiz (12/21/17 12:09 PM)
_________________________
Licensed electrologist and esthetician.
http://adrien-sanchiz-electrolysis.blogspot.fr/

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#125495 - 12/21/17 01:04 PM Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! [Re: SecretSid]
adrien_sanchiz Offline
Top 20 Contributor

Registered: 08/02/13
Posts: 306
Loc: France, Spain
If you feel more comfortable to “stick to the FB groups”, good for you.
_________________________
Licensed electrologist and esthetician.
http://adrien-sanchiz-electrolysis.blogspot.fr/

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#125496 - 12/21/17 01:07 PM Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! [Re: SecretSid]
Roselake21 Offline
Contributor

Registered: 03/02/17
Posts: 36
You are responsible for your statements. Please don't drag me Into this EmancipatedElect. I have never said there is ONLY one correct strategy.

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#125504 - 12/21/17 05:13 PM Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! [Re: Roselake21]
Josefa M. Reina Offline
Major Contributor

Registered: 05/15/17
Posts: 52
For some strange reason that I can not understand, there is a certain rejection towards the comments or advice made by a Hairtell neophyte. Especially if he or she uses "too much" passion or enthusiasm. The same thing happened with Seana at the beginning. Fortunately, that stage was left behind.

Roselake21 (whose true identity I do not know) has made the serious "mistake" of advising consumers on how to obtain reliable evidence of the effectiveness of an electrolysis treatment. Something that, on the other hand, many users have repeated here ad nauseam. How many times have we read Michael Bono say: "Test the water before jumping into the pool!"?. The difference is that Michael is a recognized authority in electrology, while Roselake21 is a complete stranger.

I have to admit, EmancipatedElec, you're right. We both do not work in the same way if what you say on your website is correct:

"Under professional conditions, electrolysis is generally very safe with only minor temporary effects after treatment, such as some redness and swelling that should abate after a couple of hours.
Although the pain of electrolysis is subjective, generally speaking, the process will hurt less than tweezing, threading or waxing. It will hurt significantly less than laser. Most of the pain is caused by a disruption to the moisture in the skin and, in thermolysis, is generally over in an instant. Usually, you won’t feel much pain when removing the treated hair afterward."



The electrolysis that I perform is not intended to affect the dermal papilla, but rather the cells responsible for hair growth. My electrolysis hurts more than tweezing, threading or waxing, and usually it has side effects that last more than two hours. However, the client NEVER feels anything when the treated hair is removed.

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#125505 - 12/21/17 09:37 PM Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! [Re: SecretSid]
Michael Bono Offline

Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 01/11/11
Posts: 3287
Loc: Santa Barbara, CA USA
I like this comment: " ... an overzealous consumer, ... has now gotten a bunch of electrologists "angry" with each other and defensive." I think this comment is cute ...

Here's my experience. An electrologist sees some of my work or hears from one of my former clients. THEN, she assumes that I MUST be doing something different, even strange (probably because my TTT is way different from hers?).

I'm now working on a client from Texas. I kid you not, his former electrologist told him that he must not come to me because I'm using some dangerous technique from AFRICA. She wasn't sure what it was, but just knew I was doing some sort of Voodoo.

People make assumption all the time. I used to argue and try to explain how mundane my treatments really are. Finally, I just gave up. And, of course, I REALLY AM USING VOODOO!

Truly, all the people in this little skirmish are people I REALLY REALLY like. So "kiss and make up." Let me be the first to give all of you (even Adrien) a great big Christmas kiss! SMACKAROO!

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#125545 - 12/27/17 08:10 PM Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! [Re: SecretSid]
hairy Harry Offline
Major Contributor

Registered: 07/08/15
Posts: 65
As a consumer I'm not going to be taking in by `before & after' photos, maybe before the internet I might have been, not now, as someone above said photos can be chopped.

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#125777 - 02/12/18 04:56 PM Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! [Re: SecretSid]
SecretSid Offline
Contributor

Registered: 11/06/17
Posts: 22
More pictures please?

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