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#127150 - 07/01/18 08:45 AM Question about Scarring?
Southernlady80 Offline
Member

Registered: 06/25/18
Posts: 7
Good morning!

I am a new electrologist. Once again, I have a bit of concern. The electrologist I apprenticed with has been gracious to refer her clients to me since retiring. I recently had a client come in that had been having her lip treated for years. I don’t know the frequency of her appointments back when she started Electrolysis. I know that now she comes in every 4-6 weeks.

At the very beginning of the appointment before we started working, she asked if her upper lip was scarred because it looks whiter than the other areas of her face. I was not able to answer her question for several reasons. First, I’ve never seen an example or picture of something similar, 2nd I have no idea what the skin looked like 20 years ago? I told her if she is really concerned that she should go to the dermatologist.

Yesterday, I had another referred client that had the same white upper lip.

For all the pros out there, have you seen something similar to what I have described or do any of you have pictures? I want to be 100% sure that I do not scar anyone’s skin!!!!!!

Second of all, why in the heck would it take 20 years?? I’m so confused be this as the posts I see from Dee and Mike indicate if you properly kill the hair the first time, this shouldn’t happen.

I also had another client tell me (without evidence of what’s described above) that she had been getting Electrolysis in Texas for about 8 years and had been in my city for 2 years and had not seen an improvement in the hair. Most of her hair is long peach fuzz.

Bewildered once again!! ............

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#127151 - 07/01/18 10:20 AM Re: Question about Scarring? [Re: Southernlady80]
Michael Bono Offline

Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 01/11/11
Posts: 3450
Loc: Santa Barbara, CA USA
Most of us think that the skin is just the skin. But it's not. Our skin is like the shoreline and ocean with different critters and conditions found at different depths. Look at the difference between the palm of your hand, and the top of your hand. Pinch the front of your neck and then the back of your neck and see the extreme differences in skin thickness. Each area of the body is extremely different and reacts differently to electrolysis. The upper lip is, indeed, the most troublesome area on the face: it's a flap of skin with no collateral blood supply from below ... unlike, say, the back.

Over the years the upper lip is the area where I have seen the most damage. Yes, scars of all sorts (contraction being the most common, and yes, delayed contraction scars). It's going to take you years to be able to sort this all out. Meanwhile, extreme caution should be your mantra until you totally understand. To answer your question about veterans screwing up? Yes, they do! When I was young and having my back hair removed, I went to a 30-year veteran for TWO YEARS and probably only 10% of the hairs were removed. Why is this?

Most electrologists live in a bubble. They have nothing with which to compare their own work. With rare exception, almost no electrologists share their work or stories (with real data) on-line or anywhere else. Thus, they go on for YEARS thinking that what they're doing is just fine. Real data is never discussed at the Electrology Conventions. And, when it is discussed, it causes a riot! Yeah, the time has come to burst some bubbles!

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#127152 - 07/01/18 10:29 AM Re: Question about Scarring? [Re: Southernlady80]
Michael Bono Offline

Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 01/11/11
Posts: 3450
Loc: Santa Barbara, CA USA
These differences are not unlike other medical procedures. For example, when a person is having electrolysis done by me, I can easily see if they had a face lift. I'm also able to tell which surgeon did the work!

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#127153 - 07/01/18 12:03 PM Re: Question about Scarring? [Re: Southernlady80]
dfahey Offline

Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 10/27/03
Posts: 9689
Loc: Columbus, Ohio
Originally Posted By Southernlady80
Good morning!


I also had another client tell me (without evidence of what’s described above) that she had been getting Electrolysis in Texas for about 8 years and had been in my city for 2 years and had not seen an improvement in the hair. Most of her hair is long peach fuzz.

............


Two years means little to me. How many hours did she put in? Did she get areas cleared and keep them cleared over a period of 18 months to 2 years, with appointments that were properly spaced? Did the practitioner have proper vision aid and lighting to see the follicle opening, after all, this is MICROSURGERY? Was there any tugging of the hair?

There is a whole lot of detail that goes into getting from long peach fuzz to hardly visible peach fuzz and on top of that, the client doesn't know what her hormonal environment is like, so hair might have to be "chased" for decades if she is an hormonally vulnerable woman.

The issue of scarring: I am not sure about the twenty years stuff. There are other factors that cause skin to change on our faces. - sun, smoking, sipping with straws and spouts in our water bottles, heredity, repeated damage with other hair removal remedies? Who really knows.

I had electrolysis when I was a teenager in the 1960's. Within the last five years or so
I noticed some lines forming around my mouth, no white areas. I don't blame it on having electrolysis. I think it is because of doing electrolysis. I tend to make all kinds of faces when I'm working. I'm trying to be conscientious of this and keep my face relaxed. Another colleaugue says she does the same thing with her face. We had a good laugh about this for sure.
_________________________
Dee Fahey, R.N., C.T.
Licensed by the State Medical Board of Ohio for Nursing license and Cosmetic Therapy/Electrolysis license
_____________________
ELECTROLYSIS FAQ'S:

British Institute & Association of Electrolysis

http://www.electrolysis.co.uk/?page_id=16

Do not give up, the beginning is always the hardest.

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#127159 - 07/03/18 09:27 AM Re: Question about Scarring? [Re: Michael Bono]
Southernlady80 Offline
Member

Registered: 06/25/18
Posts: 7
Michael,

Thank you once again for shedding a piece of light on the subject. I do wish there were more concrete examples. Try looking up contraction scarring on Google!! I am sure with more experience all of this will start to make more sense.

Funny you say that about the facelift. I had a client just tell me last week that she had a lower facelift. I would have had no idea, I just knew she had nice skin! smile

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#127160 - 07/03/18 09:43 AM Re: Question about Scarring? [Re: dfahey]
Southernlady80 Offline
Member

Registered: 06/25/18
Posts: 7
Dee,

My second celebrity discussion!! smile

Your answer makes sense. It's really hard to answer my question without knowing all of the facts! The client currently only comes in for 30 minutes every 4 weeks or so. If she has been doing that for 12 years, I can see why there wouldn't be much of a difference. I will say after everything I have studied (including your posts and Michael's posts), my one concern is that the person I studied under told me one time not to worry about the release so much.

The release and the skin reaction are my primary concerns. I often worry because my speed is a little slower than my mentor. However, I would rather be accurate and have a higher kill rate!

I haven't checked my facial expressions, I am usually concentrating so hard that I don't think about it. However, sometimes by back and neck are screaming at me and I make some adjustments there!

Thank you again! Hopefully my work will start to show some results! I've only been working on my own a couple of months now!

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#127161 - 07/03/18 09:49 AM Re: Question about Scarring? [Re: Southernlady80]
Michael Bono Offline

Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 01/11/11
Posts: 3450
Loc: Santa Barbara, CA USA
Sure ...

Another little hint. If you are doing a large job, say, a beard or extensive upper lip hairs; and weekly or bi-weekly treatments, try to consider "ongoing inflammation." I mean that the skin is going to be nicely swollen and, if you are doing weekly treatments, you are looking at nice plump skin and not able to see the final results. Think: flying a plane on instruments only.

When you are finished and the client stops electrolysis for several months, the healing resolves, and the swelling disappears. It's at that moment that the hidden problems might show-up.

Many cosmetic facial procedures unknowingly rely on creating a slight swelling of the skin; a plumping if you will. In this way a minor irritation to the skin makes the skin look much better (plumped up). The same deal with a slight sun-burn. Initially the skin looks better because it's slightly swollen (puffed up wrinkles). However, we all know the effects of long-term sun exposure.

I've just reviewed a catalogue of beauty devices and about half of them rely on this temporary plumping effect. Lots of hoaxes in the beauty profession. The Age-of-Quackery is alive and well in the beauty profession.

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#127162 - 07/03/18 10:37 AM Re: Question about Scarring? [Re: Southernlady80]
adrien_sanchiz Offline
Top 20 Contributor

Registered: 08/02/13
Posts: 317
Loc: France, Spain
I totally agree with Mike! I studied in cosmetology school and I worked in this field before to dedicate in 100% in electrology. The “Age-of-Quackery” in the beauty profession is indeed very alive !!
_________________________
Licensed electrologist and esthetician.
http://adrien-sanchiz-electrolysis.blogspot.fr/

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#127163 - 07/03/18 11:56 AM Re: Question about Scarring? [Re: Southernlady80]
Michael Bono Offline

Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 01/11/11
Posts: 3450
Loc: Santa Barbara, CA USA
Frauds in every field. The difference with electrolysis/hair removal is that it is empirical. If you kill off the hairs, it's obvious.

Frauds exist in every field. Decades ago, when we were fighting the "electronic tweezers" (Depilatron), I spoke to an FDA official in charge of medical devices. He had been a physical therapist. He said that many mainstream devices were essentially frauds. He said ... and it shocked me ... that there is no scientific evidence, for example, that diathermy and ultra-sound does anything. And yet, these modalities are a mainstay of physical therapy.

And then, we have Microdermabrasion! Sure! (I gotta do a video on this one.)

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#127164 - 07/03/18 03:13 PM Re: Question about Scarring? [Re: Southernlady80]
Iluv2zap Offline
Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 11/19/14
Posts: 1456
Interesting side note, I just happen to have been watching a video on Mega-yaucts for sale . One comment caught my attention, the sellers were looking at the spouses of the millionaire's faces for clues as to the wealth of the "millionaires" looking to buy a yauct, if they hadn't had a face lift, the millionaire couldn't afford the boat!


Edited by Iluv2zap (07/03/18 03:13 PM)
_________________________
Seana Richmond
Certified Electrologist.
Electrolysis By Seana
http://electrolysisbyseana.com

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