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#36522 - 10/07/06 08:15 PM I need opinions, only if you've tried it.
athina Offline


Registered: 10/07/06
Posts: 10
This is my first time here and I've spent hours reading but I've noticed that a lot of people that post messages here are professionals on hair removal, if you are one of those, please DO NOT reply. I would like to know the experiences from real people who have actually EXPERIENCED "PERMANENT HAIR REMOVAL", to be exact: laser, electrolysis and home electrolysis devices. I'm trying to choose between them and ONLY if you've been through that (the whole process, NOT in the middle of it), I would like to know:

1. Are you satisfied with the results? Give me a percentage on how much hair do you think was permanently removed? (I know there is no 100% permanent removal)
2. How much did it cost you and in what areas were you treated? Did you end paying more than they said they'd charge you?
3. How long did it take for the whole process, how many treatments did you needed?
4. If you tried laser, which one?
5. What's your skin color and type of hair?

I would appreciate honest opinions. Thanx

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#36523 - 10/08/06 03:11 PM Re: I need opinions, only if you've tried it.
JoanieH Offline
Major Contributor

Registered: 02/25/06
Posts: 195
Loc: S.F. Bay Area, Hayward
Hi athina,

I know that you asked the "Pros" not to respond and I hope you will forgive me for doing so. I have been licensed less than a year and am a relative newbie from the professional perspective, although I have been going through electrolysis for well over 2-1/2 years now. The results were one of the primary reasons why I decided to do this for a living as well as being a consumer.

If you will take the time to look at my personal profile, you will realize that I will be going through a lot more electrolysis than the average consumer on this forum. For me there just are not any other practical alternatives. My natural hair color does not lend itself to laser.

So far the areas that I have had total clearance on have not shown any regrowth. Although I will have to have a few hairs zapped periodically as vellus hairs are hormonally stimulated to anagen, or active growth. In effect, electrolysis does give permanent hair removal to the degree that the FDA recognizes this as such.

Right now I have had the initial clearance on my chest, breasts and upper torso. I am having between 2 to 3 hours per week done on these areas and already the amount of regrowth is becoming significantly less. The entire process will take at least a year and cost me several thousand dollars. Still though, when I compare notes with my girlfriends that have used laser, the total costs will be about the same and take about the same amount of time. Even they have had to finish up with electrolysis as there are areas that are not safe for laser and laser just does not get all of the hairs.

Anyway, I hope this helps.
Joanie
_________________________
"The job that takes the longest to finish is the one that never gets started." Traditional folk lore.

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#36524 - 10/08/06 11:34 PM Re: I need opinions, only if you've tried it.
LAgirl Offline

Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 12/22/04
Posts: 9994
Loc: New York, NY
I replied to this question on the laser forum as well. please use the search function. people who are done with treatments are not here regularly to answer this from every newbie that finds the forum, you must understand. it would be a much wiser question to ask the professionals here to give you hints for search words to use (names of people who are done and don't come read this anymore, but whose posts are archived)

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#36525 - 10/09/06 01:39 AM Re: I need opinions, only if you've tried it.
Mantaray Offline
Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 08/23/04
Posts: 711
Loc: San Diego, California
Athina, I'm a non-pro, and I've had all three types of treatments that you are asking about. I'm going to answer super, super honestly. I am not going to slant this in any way, and maybe you can benefit from my advice.

1. Are you satisfied with the results? Give me a percentage on how much hair do you think was permanently removed? (I know there is no 100% permanent removal)

Laser - Not satisfied. I now feel I cheated, they clearly should have told me it was failing. I admit it, they completely ripped me off. About ten percent in some areas, but actually a slight increase in growth activity in other areas. After all five treatments at pretty high powers my skin had suffered some drying-out and I had some erythrothrombosis; a bruise-like appearance that may never go away.

Pro Electrolysis - The first blend electrologist, not really satisfied, she was somewhat slow, and she burned-in the probe frequently. It was very painful: 60%-70% of that growth cycle on the first respective pass/clearance was cleared. Hair came back, but this was a different cycle, and was about 40% to 30% of the previous hair amount.

The second Flash Electrologist: Extremely satisfied, Once a week appointments ongoing. I wish I could see her more. I think she killed off 90% of the current hair cycle. It's only been eight weeks, so a clear judgement would be premature.

Home Electrolysis - Now, very satisfied, glad I took the time and hours learning all the basics, glad I bought good equipment. My early sessions insertion depth and angle were still unperfected. I cleared about 50% per pass/ per cycle (?). I then progressively have become better. My clearance/kill rate has greatly increased judging by the extractions, but it's still too early to give a good number. But I will say that hairs in some areas have hovered between five hairs per square inch to absolutely none, zero.


2. How much did it cost you and in what areas were you treated? Did you end paying more than they said they'd charge you?


Laser - $2,300, five sessions legs, abdomen. No rate increase, the rate stayed the same. At first they told me that six treatments would do it. When no real progress was made, they then said it would take four more, so the end price was in fact increased. I basically lost all trust in what they said, didn't like what the laser did to my skin, hated the erythrothrombosis on my stomach, and felt like they evaded my questions.


Pro Electrolysis - About $1,340, 20 sessions, Rate with first clinic was $65/hour, with the second it was $70/hour. They never have given me a quote for the areas requested, they leave it open to progress, and how much clearance I want. You see the progress, and can estimate how long it will take. The first clearance is very slow but steady, the clearances speed up greatly after that. I'm only being treated on the back of the legs, areas I cannot get myself.

Home Electrolysis - I've spent about $2,200 on the machine and magnification. and an additional few hundred on lighting, supplies, cables, books, tweezers, more tweezers. I have spent more than I planned, but seeing the payoff, I clearly feel it's money well spent. Afterall, 53 x $70 a session = $3710. So the expenditure has more than paid for itself, even if the first ten or so sessions weren't as productive as a paid session. I would spend it again. So far, about 53 sessions all on legs/feet/around groin. I haven't yet, but will also access full abdomen (easy, starting that next week), shoulders, underarms, arms, hands, privates, feet are difficult (and so are knees!) but I've done them once and let the pros get them three times. I would never, ever attempt this looking in any type of mirror, and would never ever even think about doing it to anyone else but me. the pros will get back, back of neck, back of legs.


3. How long did it take for the whole process, how many treatments did you needed?

Laser - Five treatments at six weeks apart, thirty weeks total. The process was discontinued

Pro Electrolysis - Twenty pro treatments, complete first clearance of back of legs. I will probably need at least ten more hours from a pro on back of legs.

Home Electrolysis - Fifty-three sessions of my own concurrent with pro sessions. Feet, three quarters of legs cleared on my own, complete first clearing, in some areas on second and third sweep.



4. If you tried laser, which one?

It was the Syneron Comet. A diode laser that also has an RF component. The diode component was turned up as high as any diode-only laser. It wasn't a watered-down diode, it was a diode treatement at good, strong settings, long pulse.

5. What's your skin color and type of hair?

Skin type three, dark hair, normal coarseness.

I have spent thousands of dollars, am very much wiser, and have been at hair removal, in some form, for years. I plan on posting more extensively on DIY, but for now, here is my very, very best advice:

1. Don't deal with lasers. Once you understand the laser mechanism for relaying destructive energy, you see that it's a highly inefficient way to kill hair. I don't care what anybody says, the truth is, they age your skin. Electrolysis keeps the skin way, way more youthful.

2. If you want body clearing, get treated flash-mode by someone that has a modern, computerized machine that has good skill. Don't deal with blend on the first or second clearing. Buy some sort of pain killing topical to take the edge off the pain

3. Keep your appointments, take it out of your food budget, make it part of your life. That's the way you will live for the next year(s), and you will make real progress. Each time you shave, you will notice it gets that much easier.

4. If you want to DIY:

a) It takes a lot of self-motivation and determination to be hair free.

b) For large scale body clearing, realistically and honestly, you will need a flash capable computerized machine. You will also need great magnification. The two are equally important. Cutting costs will add to frustration.

c) You need to read at least a couple books. You have to understand the science or you will not be able to troubleshoot.

d) What you are attempting is a large, time consuming project. It is not for the half-hearted. It is not for 97% of the people that attemp it. You need to be almost obsessive compulsive about it.

e) The payoff is enormous, the feeling is great, and you will get it done in a much accelerated timeline.

5. And lastly, and most importantly, value highly the advice of the pros.

Mantaray

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#36526 - 10/09/06 03:03 AM Re: I need opinions, only if you've tried it.
LAgirl Offline

Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 12/22/04
Posts: 9994
Loc: New York, NY
Quote:

This is my first time here and I've spent hours reading but I've noticed that a lot of people that post messages here are professionals on hair removal, if you are one of those, please DO NOT reply. I would like to know the experiences from real people who have actually EXPERIENCED "PERMANENT HAIR REMOVAL", to be exact: laser, electrolysis and home electrolysis devices. I'm trying to choose between them and ONLY if you've been through that (the whole process, NOT in the middle of it), I would like to know:

1. Are you satisfied with the results? Give me a percentage on how much hair do you think was permanently removed? (I know there is no 100% permanent removal)
2. How much did it cost you and in what areas were you treated? Did you end paying more than they said they'd charge you?
3. How long did it take for the whole process, how many treatments did you needed?
4. If you tried laser, which one?
5. What's your skin color and type of hair?

I would appreciate honest opinions. Thanx




Ok. Here's mine since I've had success with both laser and electrolysis:

1. Satisfied with both laser (GentleLASE alex, one of the best on the market, for light skin) and electrolysis (a few blend treatments, but the rest thermolysis and microflash). Bikini and underarms, 95% removed with laser after 5-6 treatments, type II skin, black coarse hair. Abdomen, 40% removed with laser, mostly of the coarse hair, after 4 treatments. Stopped laser treatments on that area and switched to electrolysis since hair remaining was too fine. At this point, finishing up electrolysis (thermolysis/microflash), about 85% removed permanently it looks like. Electrolysis finished on nipple and upper lip, thermolysis/microflash, took about 10-12 months. Now doing electrolysis on 5% remaining fine sparse hairs on underarms and bikini, and abdomen. About 3/4 done with electrolysis on eyebrows, probably 70% removed.

2. Laser cost me around $1500 for bikini, underarms, and abdomen (before I switched to electrolysis). Money very well spent I believe. I didn't prepay for treatments and no promises were made, and I value this approach as everyone is different. Electrolysis cost me at this point around $1800 (abdomen + chestbone, underarms, bikini after laser; upper lip, eyebrows, nipples from scratch)

3. 5 underarm, 6 bikini treatments with laser. 4 laser treatments on abdomen. Took about 10-12 months (spaced 8-12 weeks apart). Nipples about 12 months with electrolysis, upper lip only 8 months (6-8 treatments since I never touched it before), still working on eyebrows (it's been about 5-6 months), abdomen (about 8 months). Pretty much done with underarms clearance after laser.

4. Used the GentleLASE alex laser. Best on the market for light skin, type I-III. I'm a type II. Best on coarse hair.

5. Type II skin, black hair, varies in coarseness depending on the area. Bikini and underarms, and nipple coarse ("was" I should say); abdomen, upper lip fine. eyebrow avg.

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#36527 - 10/09/06 04:03 PM Re: I need opinions, only if you've tried it.
rachelle Offline
Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 06/25/04
Posts: 373
Loc: Ontario, Canada
excellent posts! ijust wanted to thank the posters cause it was nice seeing it all together in terms of experience and thsoe who had both laser and electrolysis. its clear everyone has different expereinces.

i have not tried laser or any home electrolysis device. i have had pretty much regular treatments of thermolysis and most recently blend since december 2004. I started off with a very high setting (i tolerate pain very well) on coarse chin and sideburn hairs. I also do chest bone and nipples which were not as coarse but dark and still thick. i started nipples august of 2005.

I am not done yet and it is taking a long time, but i cant stop now. i spent ALOT of money and i cant stop now and i really am hopeful for perfect hairfreeness. So far the best results i have seen are with my side burns. you can say its like 95% gone. chin is taking very long and is about um 75-80%, however i go every week for clearance and if i dont i can get quite a bit of hair there. so its hard to tell and it worries me actually. anyhow, there are areas that i know have not had hairgrowth at all. chest bone is the mystery. i started of with the least and thinnest of hairs out of all areas i had done, yet it is taking this long. but things are getting better. the hairs are finner (pretty close to the surrounding vellus) but still pretty much there cause they are longer than the surrounding hairs.

nipples take the longest to grow back. anywhere from 3 weeks to a month. but the hairs are still kinda dark. and some hairs (i have noticed) required more than 5 zaps to get rid of. those buggers!

i recently switched to a different place and am so happy i found them. cause not only are they fast, i dont scab and get pimples after treatment. even tho they are a bit more expensive and the strange part is i have to go every week now as opposed to every 2 weeks before. its werid the hair growth now. i go in more frequently??? can anyone explain this? lol

and for your information. i really really really recommend you try and get test patches by many people in your area. everyone has got different skill and its the person's talents thats more important. essentially all electro machines do the same, but its the skill of the technician thats crucial and important. look for speed and accuracy and good clearance.

be prepareed to spend alot of money, alot of time and have a strict regular scheudal. and be prepared to never wax or tweeze the treated areas again! no matter how much the hairs bug you between treatments.

dont expose the area to sun. use sun block and dont apply make up or take steamy showers and scrub right after a treatment. dont touch, dont pick and have good before and aftercare.

hmmm.. sorry i didnt answer your questions accordingly to order. but am sure you will find this useful. plz also go to my old posts and follow my treatment log if you wish.

i plan to do laser for my underarms first and than legs maybe. just waiting for things to slow down with electrolysis so i can save up money. i think laser will work well with me. 1. cause of the area is known to be pretty good with laser. 2. i got coarse black hair and fair skin there. same thing with my legs.

my face is different tho. mediterranian skin but dark coarse hair. not as fair as my legs and rest of body.

thats all i guess. good luck!

-rachel

let me remind you i was an obsessive plucker in these areas before i started electrolysis.
_________________________
mediterranian skin. blk hair. started dec04 electro on chin, sideburns and chest bone.nipples aug05. how it began: http://www.hairtell.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/18706/page//fpart/1/vc/1

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#36528 - 10/11/06 11:59 PM Re: I need opinions, only if you've tried it.
NoHair Offline
Top Ten Contributor

Registered: 07/18/02
Posts: 276
Laser: Gentlelase (not a Diode, which I'd advise to avoid). Back, 99% cleared after 6 treatments. Pricey, but only took about 8 hours of my time (which also has value); well worth it. Also, had the genital area done at the same time: 0% cleared, so a big disappointment.

Pro Electrolysis: my wife went to one. 0% cleared, expensive, bloody and painful. I don't think the pro really knew what she was doing.

DIY; Genital and underarm area: 100% after about 9 months for each area, using a home made Galvanic device for a few hours every week. I found it easy to learn and progress pretty quickly. Out of pocket costs about $100, but lots of time investment since it's a slow process, but can be done in small spurts of free time. Extremely satisfied. Never read any books, equipment cost relatively nothing. Details at http://www.geocities.com/hairfreethere/

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#36529 - 10/28/06 06:08 PM Re: I need opinions, only if you've tried it.
athina Offline


Registered: 10/07/06
Posts: 10
LAGIRL,

Thanks for your reply but I think I was very specific when I asked professionals not to answer my question. You have your point of view, I respect that, but you should also respect others point of view.

And no, I don't agree with you when you say that would be wiser to ask the professional and not the consumer. When you buy a car, don't you rather know the consumer's opinion about the car, instead of the salesperson's who's trying to make money out of you?

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#36530 - 10/28/06 06:29 PM Re: I need opinions, only if you've tried it.
athina Offline


Registered: 10/07/06
Posts: 10
Mantaray,

I would like to apologize for taking so long to reply to your message, I've been very busy.

I REALLY appreciate you took the time to answer my questions, and your HONEST opinion is exactly what I was looking for. That's why I didn't want the professionals to answer my questions.

When is about "permanent" hair removal we have to be very careful, there are too many "professionals" out there claiming they can do things, they actually can't, just to make money out of you and rip you off and not only that but you can end up permanently scarred. I'm sorry you had to go through these type of problems before, but I'm glad you finally found something that worked for you.

Thank you again and believe when I say that your opinion has been very helpful to me. I hope more people get to read your message.

Athina

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#36531 - 10/28/06 06:55 PM Re: I need opinions, only if you've tried it.
athina Offline


Registered: 10/07/06
Posts: 10
Rachelle,

Thank you for your reply.

Athina

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