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#45081 - 08/21/07 12:19 AM Build Your own 27 Mhz Epilator - using CB radio
Marthajoy Offline
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Top 20 Contributor

Registered: 05/27/06
Posts: 237
Loc: WASHINGTON
If anyone is interested, I have just ordered a Midland model 1001Z CB radio with the intent to try and rig the device to perform as an epilator. If others are interested, I may put up a web page showing the steps in the conversion of this unit.
This will be an interesting project for me. Operation will utilize CB channel 14. I may end up gutting a good part of the radio, but I could not even begin to purchase the parts I will use, for the price I paid for this radio. Unit and shipping came to less than $34.00 from Mogiz, LLC. I was able to download the owner manual from Midland.
Anyway, anyone let me know if they are interested in following my CB to Epilator conversion.
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Martha Montgomery, CCE
Puget Sound Electrology

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#45082 - 08/21/07 01:00 AM Re: Build Your own 27 Mhz Epilator - using CB radio [Re: Marthajoy]
James W. Walker VII Offline

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Registered: 06/03/02
Posts: 8055
Loc: Buffalo NY, & Traveling the US...
You know we have lots of Do-Each-Other-Electrologists and DIY'ers who want to know about this. After all, we have people building boot-leg One Touches and Vectors on this board.
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#45196 - 08/25/07 05:44 AM Re: Build Your own 27 Mhz Epilator - using CB radio [Re: James W. Walker VII]
Marthajoy Offline
HairTell Pro
Top 20 Contributor

Registered: 05/27/06
Posts: 237
Loc: WASHINGTON
Update on progress:
I have ordered the CB, it is due to arrive on Monday.
I have contacted Midland, and they emailed me both the schematic and a block diagram. This is going to be a fun mod.
The first thing I want to do when the radio arrives is to document the signal levels at different stages of the transmitter.
Next I want to rig the transmitter so that it does slow thermolysis using and external pulse generator. This conversion is very easy. I will use the ext. speaker jack to feed the pulse into the radio. It will trigger the power transistor with a negative pulse on the emitter. The output transistor can easily handle even Microflash speeds based on its power ratings. But initially, I want to keep the power level down and compare the 27 mhz with my 13.5 mhz clareblend ultrablend. That will give me an exact comparison on the effects of 13.5 mhz vs. 27 mhz. After completing that checkout, I wish to remove a lot of the unused parts, and to build a galvanic circuit for the radio. This will permit Blend to be performed using 27 mhz.
What I would like my final project to be, is to up the power ratings and to control setting with a real computer using the usb port. All setting will be controllable from the computer. This will be something that could even be marketed. Settings would be able to be save in client files along with time and anything else one would want. I have some programable IC's being sent to me to experiment with.
Anyway, that is a little update. One will certainly be able to make a 27 mhz thermolysis epilator for less than $100 and very little more for a blend unit, but the blend will require more time, as lots of parts will need to be removed, to make space for new circuitry.
_________________________
Martha Montgomery, CCE
Puget Sound Electrology

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#45249 - 08/28/07 12:30 AM Re: Build Your own 27 Mhz Epilator - using CB radi [Re: Marthajoy]
Marthajoy Offline
HairTell Pro
Top 20 Contributor

Registered: 05/27/06
Posts: 237
Loc: WASHINGTON
For anyone interested. Today, I recieved my Midland 1001Z CB. I took some initial level measurements. Without modification, I get about 30 vp-p at the antenna terminal. With this level, thermolysis epilation normally will occur in a half Second to a little over one second. If doing thermolysis on yourself i.e. DIY then you can probably get by using manual keying of the microphone.
If you wish to work with a foot switch, a switch can be wired to a microphone connector between pins 3 and 1.
Now about probes. I find a vast difference in the effectiveness of different probes at this frequency. The worst cords to use, that I have on hand were the Clareblend BNC probes. I have two different probes, and the signal loss on both went down to only 6 volts peak to peak at the tip. Using Dectro probes for my cleo or other 13.5 mhz epilators yealded about 15 volts p-p at the tip. I had modified one probe to use a BNC connect, and another one with just a banana plug for Glavanic use in my experiementing. My recommendation, would be to use a UHF to SMA adapter on the output of the CB and then to use a cable made for the Apilus Platinum. The cables that are in use for the 13.5 mhz machines are just not very good at 27 mhz. Epilation will occur very quickly, but at these levels it is managable for those wishing to use something on themselves. I will recommend having a timed circuit before suggesting anyone even consider using it on anyone other than themselves. Manually, you will feel the heat being generated and will know when you have generated enough heat.
I wish to get this probe loss problem out of the way, before I run a test to see if 27 mhz is really much faster and less painful the 13.5 mhz. I will probably, search for my own cable and make up my own probes if possible. But for those who would like to get started using something cheap, and readily available, this is something someone may want to consider. It is not as capable as my Cleo but RF wise it is almost as capable as the thermolysis on my Clareblend/Ultoblend Ultrablend.
Shortly, I will pick up my IC chips and get started on building a pulse generator. Also, remember for now, that the frequency authorized for medical use is Channel 14. Just make certain that you are on that channel.
_________________________
Martha Montgomery, CCE
Puget Sound Electrology

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#45473 - 09/02/07 03:31 AM Re: Build Your own 27 Mhz Epilator - using CB radi [Re: Marthajoy]
Marthajoy Offline
HairTell Pro
Top 20 Contributor

Registered: 05/27/06
Posts: 237
Loc: WASHINGTON
Update on using a CB radio as is - for an epilator:
I have found that hairs do release very quickly at 27 mhz. With the levels observed on a scope, I expected it to take about half a second for epilation to occur. What I have found is even a brief duration of about 1/10 of a second can cause spots which initially do not appear, but later appear and last up to a week or so. This indicates that even a tenth of a second at 27 mhz with level that would take longer with a 13.5 mhz machine does indicate its timing may be to long.
My recommendations are that if anyone is considering using a CB without modification, to use it that way only in areas less visable until you have enough experience with the machine to progress.
It is true that with very quick pulsing of RF energy, that I was not even able to feel the heat. It is when I felt the heat, that I later see tiny raised areas which seem to last for a lot longer than my experience with 13.5 mhz. There is certainly enough energy in a CB radio to kill hair. It is now up to controlling that energy so as to not over-treat.
Next project step is making a pulse generator to perform accurate timing operations.
_________________________
Martha Montgomery, CCE
Puget Sound Electrology

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#45477 - 09/02/07 05:43 AM Re: Build Your own 27 Mhz Epilator - using CB radi [Re: Marthajoy]
James W. Walker VII Offline

Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 06/03/02
Posts: 8055
Loc: Buffalo NY, & Traveling the US...
Now you see why the Apilus Platinum does NOT allow continuous foot pedal operation. One can only make a setting and even if the foot pedal is being used, it delivers the measured dose of energy, not a steady stream until the foot pedal is released.
_________________________
http://www.executiveclearance.com/beforeandafter.html
Setting a goal is not the main thing. It is deciding how you will go about achieving it and staying with that plan. --- Tom Landry
Has this site helped you? Pay it forward. Donate to keep HairTell & Hairfacts Online at http://www.hairfacts.com/feedback/support-this-site/

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#45482 - 09/02/07 11:15 PM Re: Build Your own 27 Mhz Epilator - using CB radi [Re: James W. Walker VII]
Marthajoy Offline
HairTell Pro
Top 20 Contributor

Registered: 05/27/06
Posts: 237
Loc: WASHINGTON
Yes, James,
I must admit, that I was very skeptical that there was really that much difference between 13.5 mhz and 27 mhz. But even my first most basic tests are proving there really is a major difference between the two frequencies.
I have ordered parts to make a little circuit card that uses a simple CD4013 chip that will serve as a one shot pulse generator for my next step. Parts for two circuits only cost about $4 from Allied Electronics. So that works out to about $2 apiece. The volume control on the CB is perfect for the timing control. I am pleasantly surprised at the power capabilites of the output transistor in this unit. It is rated at 4 watts at 12 volts, but it is capable of 80 volts, and is rated for 10 watts. The output on the Clareblend Ultrablend is only rated of 7 watts. Its maximum voltage collector-emitter is 65 volts. So this CB has components rated higher than the Clareblend.
I really need to see about ordering a probe used with the Apilus Platinum. Trying to purchase good RF cable in short lengths looks like it is going to be difficult. Also I am finding it difficult to find the connectors used on the end of the probes for inserting probes. I really wonder who makes them. But like apilus, I would most certainly keep the SMA connector for cable to unit attachment.
_________________________
Martha Montgomery, CCE
Puget Sound Electrology

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#45483 - 09/03/07 01:36 AM Re: Build Your own 27 Mhz Epilator - using CB radi [Re: Marthajoy]
James W. Walker VII Offline

Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 06/03/02
Posts: 8055
Loc: Buffalo NY, & Traveling the US...
Need I remind you that Texas Electrolysis Supply could have you a Platinum cord in a jiffy?

One of Apilus' main issues was the class of electrologists trained to "find the edge of the client's pain threashold" when creating a treatment setting. Can you imagine the damage a Platinum would dish out is it were set high enough to actually HURT?
_________________________
http://www.executiveclearance.com/beforeandafter.html
Setting a goal is not the main thing. It is deciding how you will go about achieving it and staying with that plan. --- Tom Landry
Has this site helped you? Pay it forward. Donate to keep HairTell & Hairfacts Online at http://www.hairfacts.com/feedback/support-this-site/

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#45484 - 09/03/07 02:53 AM Re: Build Your own 27 Mhz Epilator - using CB radi [Re: James W. Walker VII]
Marthajoy Offline
HairTell Pro
Top 20 Contributor

Registered: 05/27/06
Posts: 237
Loc: WASHINGTON
James,
Yes, Texas Electrolysis Supply is my major supplier along with Dectro California. Either one supplies my needs very quickly. I have ordered some things through Prestige, but delivery seems to take just a while longer. But much much faster than Electric Spa which took 3 weeks just to get me some sample uniprobes and a H forcep. But, to their credit they did offer free samples.
This is Labor day weekend, so I will hold off for the holiday. I do not want to be in too much of a hurry. I like to think things out a bit, and to work in stages. This project allows me to do just that.
There are even more options that I could add to the project as well. If I key the epilator as I plan at the final output stage, I can also make a little audio oscillator and feed the mic input and produce modulation like I believe the VMC does.
Also James, about pain - The reason that it hurts less is because the heat generated is maintained in a very small space. If however, someone not trained in the proper probe placement, happens to fire off the epilator where the nerves are in the follicle instead of at the bottom where the papilla resides, then they will really experience what pain is. I really believe that someone wanting to use this modality, really should know what they are doing. They should be able to look at a hair and know what stage of growth the hair was in, and to be able to be able to tell how deep the sebacceous gland, by observing the moisture layer around the hair. They should be able to identify what areas have cells capable of generating new hairs. Someone should not just purchase or make an epilator and figure that is all they need. But if someone is willing to put in some time learning what is going on, it should not take $8000 to purchase a good 27 mhz epilator.
I really do believe that Dectro is a wonderful company. I do believe that Apilus is probably the best machine out there. For someone just starting out, I believe they are the way to go. I back that up, with my own experience. That is why I went to them for training. You will not find an easier machine to operate - especially for a beginner.
I for one, have always believed in providing as much versatility as possible in anything I use. When I worked at Boeing, I helped to keep every available option available for the operator to choose from. On my final version of the conversion, that is what I wish to strive for in this project. All parameters available on a computer screen that an operator can choose from. Manufacturers have done a wonderful job of making something very portable and simple to use. My idea might not be as portable - being that it will require a personal computer like a laptop to interface with it. But it will not have the costs and breakdowns associated with touch membraine switches. Those processes are just out of reach for Do it yourself construction.
Personally, I think that prices will come down after other companies also start marketing 27 mhz machines as well. We will see, or at least I hope that happens. I will readily admit that I am so glad that electrolysis as a field has not remained still over the last dozen years. Knowing what it was like for me going through electrolysis that long ago, really makes me appreciate the differences being offered today.
_________________________
Martha Montgomery, CCE
Puget Sound Electrology

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#45492 - 09/03/07 10:48 AM Re: Build Your own 27 Mhz Epilator - using CB radi [Re: Marthajoy]
James W. Walker VII Offline

Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 06/03/02
Posts: 8055
Loc: Buffalo NY, & Traveling the US...
Buyer Beware: Prestige Electrolysis Supply is NOTORIOUS for botching orders, sending you something other than you ordered, and refusing to make good. I don't know anyone who has used them for a year without having this experience. They even had the nerve to argue that I had ordered a WOMAN'S Lab Coat with my name on it, instead of admitting that they either could not get a men's coat, or were just so used to serving women only that they just typed in the usual F in the computer when filling out the order to their subcontractor. I still have a delux FEMALE lab coat, still in the plastic with MY name on it because they patently refuse to admit their error.

Now this is just the most egregious case, but almost every time I ordered with them, at least ONE thing on my order (I don't make orders without it being a list) would come out botched (typoes in the data processing dept perhaps?) and I would receive something that I did not order, (but had paid for) and would be missing something that I had ordered. Their cheerful customer service response was always the same, "We can go on and order that other item you missed now, what credit card do you want to put it on?"

Long story short, I don't know anyone who has not been burned by that experience with them at least once.

On the other subject, I don't see any indication that there will be a crowd of 27mhz machines coming to market any time soon. All Apilus' competitors are sticking to the line that 27mhz either doesn't exist, or that it doesn't offer anything to the treatment, or that it is just a promotional gimmick that has no actual value to the industry other than giving them an excuse to charge more since no one else is bothering to do it.

I wish I had you there for some of the arguments I have had so that you could talk the technical talk better than I could. In one combative conversation, a certain Apilus representative was challenged "First 13mhz, now 27, why didn't you do 54mhz if higher frequencies are so good?" The simple reply was, because the higher the frequency, the more you must be concerned with the control of the treatment energy, and the powersupply issues increase. It made sense to me, and you seem to be finding the same thing.

Oh yeah, and they also had a time of it trying to fit everything into the shell they wanted to use for the epilator when making the Platinum. Anyone handling a Platinum, SX-500 and Cleo can instantly tell the machines get heavier as the price rises, and since I have seen them all "open case" I know there are no lead weights in there to make that difference. All the extra weight is extra parts.
_________________________
http://www.executiveclearance.com/beforeandafter.html
Setting a goal is not the main thing. It is deciding how you will go about achieving it and staying with that plan. --- Tom Landry
Has this site helped you? Pay it forward. Donate to keep HairTell & Hairfacts Online at http://www.hairfacts.com/feedback/support-this-site/

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