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#78939 - 10/01/10 01:40 AM Re: Selectif Pro - Applisonix [Re: BridgetBee]
dee.oz (ireland) Offline
Major Contributor

Registered: 08/06/10
Posts: 87
bridgetbee.. how do you find it? do you find you are getting much reduction? i let them pluck a few hairs only... on the RHS of my face, the long hairs are gone.. on the LFH (out of about 5 really long ones) i have 2 left, so yes it is working... but i have millions of downy hair on my face which i was hoping would be removed.. but doesnt seem to be... They recommend waxing after each treatment to get the remaining hairs in to anagen phase for next time etc.. i think i am going to start with my upper lip - wax that and then do treatments.. to be honest, i find electrolysis excrutiating pain on my upper lip... however i am afraid to get the rest of my face waxed.. i have read so much about this applisonix selectif pro and practically everybody who has reviews on it is getting good responses.. i guess becasue it said on the website 38% reduction after initial treatment, i am expecting wonders.. i definetly do not agree with that statement.. also i find it all a bit confusing - i have had 3 treatments on the LHS of my face and only 2 ont he right and i do see marked improvement on the RHS - sparser hair growth but on the LFS not hat much difference apart from those few long hairs and event hey are not all completely gone.. i contacted a number of beauticians in ireland explaining i was in melbourne (so hoping i would get honest reviews) and they all except one said they find the selectif pro brilliant.. the lady who is doing my seletif pro is actually doing her own upper lip also and is getting amamzing results after only 3 treatments (mind you she not that hairy anyway).. i honestly do have millions of blonde hairs on my face, so god knows how many treatments i will need.. originally i wanted something that would not scar my skin (like i have found electrolyis does) and would get rid of the long hairs.. the selectif pro has done this for me but now i am getting greedy and want all my hairs gone or a good percentage of them.. it would be just so nice to be able to tie up my hair and go out on a sunny day and not have to worry about if im in direct sunlight when talking to people etc.. i do be so worried about it i dont even concentrate on our conversations, just wondering how obvious it is to people.. i know only people who are in same position will relate to this feeling, other people just dont understand how much it consumes us worrying about it.. i really hope this works for me and restore some of my confidence.. i could really do with it...

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#78941 - 10/01/10 04:02 AM Re: Selectif Pro - Applisonix [Re: dee.oz (ireland)]
dfahey Offline

Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 10/27/03
Posts: 9689
Loc: Columbus, Ohio
With all the tweezing and waxing that is being done, I would expect to hear that people using this ultrasonic device are seeing "results"!!!! I have nothing to be impressed about after hearing this. Sorry.

Good luck to all of you and keep this thread alive.
_________________________
Dee Fahey, R.N., C.T.
Licensed by the State Medical Board of Ohio for Nursing license and Cosmetic Therapy/Electrolysis license
_____________________
ELECTROLYSIS FAQ'S:

British Institute & Association of Electrolysis

http://www.electrolysis.co.uk/?page_id=16

Do not give up, the beginning is always the hardest.

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#78944 - 10/01/10 10:38 AM Re: Selectif Pro - Applisonix [Re: dfahey]
dee.oz (ireland) Offline
Major Contributor

Registered: 08/06/10
Posts: 87
HI dfahey.. does tweezing and waxing reduce hairs long term? From the reviews i have received and read, it is long term.. i didnt think waxing/plucking reduces hairs long term - does it? am i understanding your comment above correctly - is that what you meant? Also thank you for your wish of good luck - i need it and i will keep this thread going and let everybody know whether it has worked for me or not.. thanks

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#78949 - 10/01/10 01:51 PM Re: Selectif Pro - Applisonix [Re: dee.oz (ireland)]
dfahey Offline

Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 10/27/03
Posts: 9689
Loc: Columbus, Ohio
What is your definition of long term, dee 0z? When you pull a hair by any means from waxing to using your fingers, depending on the hair structure, it takes any where from 6-16 weeks for it to return as a new hair.

Yes, indeed, I'm sure the hairtell community would soak up any observations that you have about this new device. The company is working had to market and distribute their product, worldwide. As consumers try it and couple years pass, we should get a clearer picture of things to come. I don't anticipate too many rave reviews. If women with peach fuzz, or otherwise, think this will solve their problem, I feel sorry for them when they discover that it has done poo. The device is clumsy and slow. The slowest electrologist can go faster and deliver more heat to the lower hair follicle than this device can. A modern electrologist with a high tech set up can treat anywhere from 10-20 hairs per minute in auto-sensor mode with nothing more than a little pinkness and minimal swelling. This ultrasonic device allows for 1-6 hairs per minute, depending on the technician? I read that the the temperature climbs to a measly 70 degrees? You need more heat than that to damage a hair follicle. If that is not true, then educate me, please.

I specialize in treating light colored peach fuzz and let me be honest here, as I look down on a womans face with my magnification, there are hundreds of thousands of fine hairs and follicle openings that are not showing a hair at that particular time. If I can treat 800- 900 of those hairs in an hour, then that is fantastic speed. With this bulky tip they show and the amount of time it takes to treat each hair, how long do you think it will be until they conquer all that bothersome hair? Throw in the obstacle of hair growth cycles and you got a bigger hurdle. You are better off getting electrolysis from the slowest electrologist in Ireland.

This does not sound ideal for you. I don't like the waxing and pulling part. I don't like the slowness. Though not positive about the level of heat it delivers, I don't like the low heat of 70 degrees. I haven't read any clinical studies so as to understand their methodology of testing. Where can I find that information? My negativity stems from all these doubts and my knowledge of hair growth cycles and the copius amounts of hair many women have on their faces. It is unbelievable! Even with my speed, my peach fuzz women and I become new best friend for two to three years as we continually thin down those countless fine hairs they desire to eliminate. Even then, we can never hope to get to a hairless face, nor should we want to.

I say this with concern for you, your time and your wallet. The only thing good I can say about ASP, it is painless. In my industry the saying goes, " A painless procedure is a worthless procedure.". It is natural to be drawn to new technology and I think you should go forward and trust, if that is your emotional need. On a practical note, remember,you can only evaluate its effectiveness after ONE YEAR of doing nothing. Anything else is meaningless and misleading. The Israeli's are very good at developing new devices and I know they are onto a concept that may be useful for the hairy. Maybe they will continue to improve on this technology, but with what I know now about how this device works, I'm still not jumping up and down. Good luck again, sincerely.
_________________________
Dee Fahey, R.N., C.T.
Licensed by the State Medical Board of Ohio for Nursing license and Cosmetic Therapy/Electrolysis license
_____________________
ELECTROLYSIS FAQ'S:

British Institute & Association of Electrolysis

http://www.electrolysis.co.uk/?page_id=16

Do not give up, the beginning is always the hardest.

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#79033 - 10/04/10 08:55 AM Re: Selectif Pro - Applisonix [Re: dfahey]
dee.oz (ireland) Offline
Major Contributor

Registered: 08/06/10
Posts: 87
hi dfahey, thank you for your response - i know it takes a while to write these responses.. to answer some of your questions, in my mind longterm is forever (hopefully).. also with regard to your comment about hairs growing back between 6-16 weeks, i reckon i must be super hairy so, because mine has always been 2-3 weeks.. also with the selectif pro, it is much faster than electrolysis.. when i started i was told it was five times faster to do a treatment and i thoroughly agree with this.. electrolysis is definetly much slower.. yes the applisonix does only heat up to about 70 degrees (i have no idea if that is high enough/not - cant really comment on that)...im in melbourne australia and just so other people know ive heard of another salon in melbourne getting the applisonix - the salon is in brunswick.. i dont know if this will work for me (but so far i have noticed a bit of a difference) and i promise to keep updating as i go along.. i am hoping is will.. from the responses other users of the selectif pro have left on this forum, it seems to have worked for them.. samanthajane, vell and another beautician who had it in her salon (think it was isabelcruz - will have to check) have all done good reviews on it.. samanthajane has totally finsihed on her face and is now working on her underarms.. i cant remember if she plucked/waxed as well, i think she mighnt have had - i will have to check her previous posts.. i havent read a users response yet where it hasnt worked.. however when i emailed the (11) beauticians in ireland who have it in their salon, 1 or 2 said it would take more than the recommended amount of treatments stated on the applisonix website.. anyway fingers crossed it does.. i need something to work.. i tried electrolysis for 8 years and it doesnt seem to have done anything for me - i dont know why it hasnt worked for me, from the responses on this forum, it seems to work for most people.. also i got some scarring from it.. thank u dfahey for your response, i will keep everybody updated and if it is a hoax product i will post that on this forum .. but for now im hoping it will work...

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#79036 - 10/04/10 02:10 PM Re: Selectif Pro - Applisonix [Re: dee.oz (ireland)]
dfahey Offline

Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 10/27/03
Posts: 9689
Loc: Columbus, Ohio
Electrolysis is not slower from what I have seen in the apillisonix videos. I can remove anywhere from 500-1,000 hairs per hour depending on the how challenging an area is. This device cannot. You are marketing a product that cannot deliver better than what a skilled electrologist can accomplish and I'm going to call you on that. If you have seen the slowest electrologist in Melbourne using multi-needle galvanic, of course you may think this way. If you have had treatments with a modern electrologist using MicrFlash or PicoFlash thermolysis, you would understand what the point I am trying to make.

Your hairs do not grow back in 2-3 weeks - it is impossible for a hair to regenerate that fast. What you see are the next group of new hairs that were forming underneath the skin while you were having the hairs you could see treated. Those treated hairs were treated, but then 2-3 weeks later, the new group of hairs are ready to sprout. I don't think you have a good understanding of HAIR GROWTH CYCLES, so do yourself a favor and research this.

Other posters here using this ultrasound device have yet to have enough time elapse. If they are waxing, OF COURSE they think they are seeing results. You, nor I, can comment on effectiveness because no one has stated that they have done nothing for one year after their treatments.

We always appreciate honest feedback. You have no idea how much that helps others who come here after you.

Dee
_________________________
Dee Fahey, R.N., C.T.
Licensed by the State Medical Board of Ohio for Nursing license and Cosmetic Therapy/Electrolysis license
_____________________
ELECTROLYSIS FAQ'S:

British Institute & Association of Electrolysis

http://www.electrolysis.co.uk/?page_id=16

Do not give up, the beginning is always the hardest.

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#79071 - 10/05/10 09:45 AM Re: Selectif Pro - Applisonix [Re: dfahey]
dee.oz (ireland) Offline
Major Contributor

Registered: 08/06/10
Posts: 87
HI dfahey, thank you for your last post. I found it very interesting to read...

In response to your above statement: "Electrolysis is not slower from what I have seen in the apillisonix videos. I can remove anywhere from 500-1,000 hairs per hour depending on the how challenging an area is. This device cannot"

I followed up on your recommendation of doing some research and please check out the attached website: http://www.applisonix.com/userfiles/Article-Jeffrey%20Berg-Nov08.pdf - it says that the applisonix does 15-20 hairs per minute; which is 900-1200 hairs per hour.... And as a user, I agree with this and can confirm it...

Perhaps in the videos you watched, the beautician was working at a slower pace because she was talking about the product (at the same time) and maybe thats why you thought it was slower (or counted it up wrong).

Also with regard to your comment about hair growth cycles (6 - 16 weeks), i did try and do some research on female facial hair growth cyles but could not find a specific time period for female facial hair growth cycles. Your information above (6 - 16 weeks) is very specific - could you please post up the documentation reference for this - I would love to read more on this subject (as I am sure would a lot of other people on this forum). Does this mean that if you get a lip wax, it will not grow back for a minimum of 6 weeks? I find this quite interesting because when i got lip waxes, the hair had always grown back before 6 weeks. I was getting lip waxes approximately every 3 weeks.. Do you know why this may be happening?

With regard to your third paragraph and users reviews, I have read reviews from Denmark, UK, Israel, Italy, Ireland, Moscow, Japan and Spain, reviews on this forum (samathajane, isabelcruz) and another forum (called hairremoval about)and have also read about the Frost & Sullivan Award which was given to Applisonix for this product (which from my understanding is a difficult award to obtain)... If you would like to read some of this information that was probably not in those videos you watched, I could forward it on to you...

I am trying to research this product as much as I possibly can.. I also believe that forum users appreciate honest feedback, thus why I am on this forum and trying to find out how consumers are using this product and what their outcomes are.. I am hoping that by posting up my experiences and reading other peoples experience, we can all find out more about the applisonix and determine if it is working for the users or not...

Thank you again for your posts and looking forward to reading your information on hair growth cycles (as that will help everyone on this forum)....

Dee oz...

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#79078 - 10/05/10 04:01 PM Re: Selectif Pro - Applisonix [Re: dee.oz (ireland)]
dfahey Offline

Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 10/27/03
Posts: 9689
Loc: Columbus, Ohio
* I'll respond in red to all your questions.


In response to your above statement: "Electrolysis is not slower from what I have seen in the apillisonix videos. I can remove anywhere from 500-1,000 hairs per hour depending on the how challenging an area is. This device cannot"

I followed up on your recommendation of doing some research and please check out the attached website: http://www.applisonix.com/userfiles/Article-Jeffrey%20Berg-Nov08.pdf - it says that the applisonix does 15-20 hairs per minute; which is 900-1200 hairs per hour.... And as a user, I agree with this and can confirm it...

* I read the article and I don't believe those numbers. Here is one video on youtube I was referring to about the speed part:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiFBWZUjCH4

Perhaps in the videos you watched, the beautician was working at a slower pace because she was talking about the product (at the same time) and maybe thats why you thought it was slower (or counted it up wrong).

* No, I still doubt this because the heat that has to be transferred to the tissue that helps hair grow at the bottom of the follicle would take longer than the .02 -.09 seconds it takes for electrolysis to heat up the tissue. In addition, it takes 127 degrees F. to electro-coagulate human tissue. Your device claims 70 degrees F. hardly enough to make this permanent. There will be regrowth, but if they have you wax more than one time, you will believe this is actually working. Electrolysis is PERMANENT hair removal and your device is classified as LONG- TERM hair removal. Does that give you more security knowing that you are spending time and money on a long term solution instead of a permanent solution. The catch phrase here is painless, but they do not emphasize that the hair will back. Also, any technician bending over the table in that position to treat a supposedly 900-1,200 per hour will not have a back or a neck at some point. That is excrutiating to watch in itself.

Also with regard to your comment about hair growth cycles (6 - 16 weeks), i did try and do some research on female facial hair growth cyles but could not find a specific time period for female facial hair growth cycles. Your information above (6 - 16 weeks) is very specific - could you please post up the documentation reference for this - I would love to read more on this subject (as I am sure would a lot of other people on this forum).

* we have published charts on different body areas here on hairtell. Do a search for 'REGROWTH CHARTS'. There is a sticky on this as well. I may do it for you, but my time is limited now. Just try for yourself and if you have no luck, I'll do it eventually.

Does this mean that if you get a lip wax, it will not grow back for a minimum of 6 weeks? I find this quite interesting because when i got lip waxes, the hair had always grown back before 6 weeks. I was getting lip waxes approximately every 3 weeks.. Do you know why this may be happening?

* I do. You are not taking into account that new hairs were still under your skin when you waxed, so how could the wax have pulled out those hairs when they were in hiding below your skin? So, in your case, 2 weeks later, the NEW hair emerges. IT IS NOT THE SAME HAIR THAT WAS WAXED 2 WEEKS AGO. HAIR CANNOT GROW BACK THAT FAST. That is why you have got to have an excellent understanding of hair growth cycles.

With regard to your third paragraph and users reviews, I have read reviews from Denmark, UK, Israel, Italy, Ireland, Moscow, Japan and Spain, reviews on this forum (samathajane, isabelcruz) and another forum (called hairremoval about)and have also read about the Frost & Sullivan Award which was given to Applisonix for this product (which from my understanding is a difficult award to obtain)...

* Don't fall into the trap of groupthink. It's human beings behaving at their worse. Think this through scientifically. As far as the Frost&Sullivan award, send me documentation about their criteria for awarding businesses and such. I have observed certain people getting the Noble Peace Prize and laughed at what a joke it was. I'm not impressed by awards because I have heard of too many backroom dealing stuff or people with their own agenda's .


If you would like to read some of this information that was probably not in those videos you watched, I could forward it on to you...

* Please post anything you want here for all to see. Don't load my mailbox anymore than it is. Post it here. This is not a secret. Clinical studies would be good. Copy and paste because links disappear over time.

I am trying to research this product as much as I possibly can.. I also believe that forum users appreciate honest feedback, thus why I am on this forum and trying to find out how consumers are using this product and what their outcomes are.. I am hoping that by posting up my experiences and reading other peoples experience, we can all find out more about the applisonix and determine if it is working for the users or not...


*You are wonderful and I for one appreciate your careful and respectfull discussion.


Thank you again for your posts and looking forward to reading your information on hair growth cycles (as that will help everyone on this forum)....

* You are most welcomed! I am not emotional about this product. Having removed hair for a long time, clues me in on some of these claims. IT IS VERY IMPORTANT that those reading this keep in mind that those like dee oz using this device must not do anything for 52 weeks to remove their hair, after they are told they need no more treatments. If the consumer thinks this is permanent, DO NOTHING FOR ONE YEAR, and come back and tell all what you are left with. That is what I am waiting for from this thread, otherwise, I will just be repeating myself. Let's hurry up and wait.

_________________________
Dee Fahey, R.N., C.T.
Licensed by the State Medical Board of Ohio for Nursing license and Cosmetic Therapy/Electrolysis license
_____________________
ELECTROLYSIS FAQ'S:

British Institute & Association of Electrolysis

http://www.electrolysis.co.uk/?page_id=16

Do not give up, the beginning is always the hardest.

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#79294 - 10/12/10 08:48 AM Re: Selectif Pro - Applisonix [Re: dfahey]
dee.oz (ireland) Offline
Major Contributor

Registered: 08/06/10
Posts: 87
HI Dfahey,
I had another selectif pro appointment yesterday, the lady doing it said the selectif pro heats up to 70 degrees celsius... not 70 degrees fahrenheit..Again yesterday it seemed like she did loads more hairs than when i get electrolysis done. However i dont believe my electrolygist gets anywhere close to the numbers you said you could do.. She takes her time but I feel she is quite professional (much better than my previous electrolygist I had for 8 years - with no reduction in hair growth)...

Thank you for the name search "regrowth charts" - i did a read.. It was very interesting and yes it sounds logical, i guess a bit disappointing making me realise I now have millions more hairs than i thought i had..

I am not going to let the lady doing selectif pro pluck...I have had 6 treatments done now I think (or maybe 5- losing count).. the lady plucked no more than 10 ahirs all up (I only let her do it once cos I had to go somewhere the next day).. So I am going to stick with the treatments of selectif pro and electrolysis for the next few months and see what happens..

I woudl appreciate if you could answer a question for me.. how often should someone get electrolysis done - i am currently getting it done every 2 weeks...

The long hairs on the LHS have not come back yet.. (usually they come back/new ones growing every 2 weeks).. however over last few weeks the RHS long hairs did not return and now the LHS ones have not returned. So it will be interesting to see what happens over the next few months..

I am thinking of waxing my upper lip and doing the selectif pro on that - that way I give it a fair go and see if it works or not.. i waxed my upper lip for years so it doesnt bother me too much to do that again.. however i dont want to wax anywhere else on my face...

To give people some idea of how I feel about my treatments, i reckon I have about 10% reduction since i started my first treatment - no where near the 38% reduction they say after 2 treatments.. I have squashed a good few treatemnts in to a small amount of time, i think im going to just do a treatment every 2nd week from now on (1 side of the face at a time - so essentially that means eg LHS every 4 weeks and RHS every 4 weeks etc)... The lady does my upper lip in most sessions so I should be able to see improvement in that before anywhere else i guess. also according to the manual (which i found via google) - the upper lip supposedly only needs 6-8 treatments..

Dfahey, i really appreciate you getting back to me and getting me to look up the regrowth cycles and reading James post about the grid system explained it very well.. I understand how you ahve said you should not do anything for 12 months after to ensure it is permanent... Considering I have been doing electrolysis for the last 8 years every 2/3 weeks, i would actually be happy if I could even reduce that to every 4/5 months and if it ends up that i do find something to work permanently for me, well then i'll be ecstatic.. I have so much to do and it so fine and blond - whatever i do will probably take ages... It will be very interesting to see what I am posting up about my progress in 3 months time even..

Also my other question is - does waxing actually cause more hair growth/induce hair growth? I feel that i should give the selectif pro a fair go and do the treatments the way im meant to but too afraid to wax anywhere else on face.. My other question is have you heard of many people having improvement in hirsituism with spironolactone? it woked fantastically for me for my skin, but I havent noticed any hair reduction and i have been on it for about 1.5 years now... (since last child)...

Anyway thank you again for your time and helping everybody get wiser about hair issues...

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#79361 - 10/15/10 03:40 AM Re: Selectif Pro - Applisonix [Re: dee.oz (ireland)]
odi Offline
Top 10 Contributor

Registered: 05/08/09
Posts: 380
Dfahey, this machine is made in Israel, in Israel they use Celsius not Farenheight.

70C = 158F

dee.oz, thanks for the updates, If i decide to buy this machine in the future, it would be thanks to your updates.
_________________________
Laser Hair Removal Toronto (my own clinic)

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