Before & After electrolysis photos!

Posted by: SecretSid

Before & After electrolysis photos! - 12/09/17 07:22 AM

After reading Roselake's thread about electrologist should provide more pictures, I decided to create this thread.

This is a thread for before&after pictures and basically just for this purpose. The idea is to motivate people who is bothered by hairs, and make them believe that it's actually possible to remove hair permanently, hence: YES it exists a permanent hair removal solution.

I don't have any pictures myself to post right now.
But below I posted a before & after picture done by the talented electrologist: Josefa M. Reina in this forum.

Just follow this example, and we be good to go:

BEFORE (February 2016):

AFTER first electrolysis clearing (June 2016):

Posted by: Roselake21

Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! - 12/09/17 07:57 AM

Thank you for creating this tread. Everyone who have been treated by Josefa or/and see the pictures of her work can attest she is doing something very good by killing the hair she treats in one time. There is no doubt about it because there is proof of that. When you pay for a service like this one you shouldn't believe people based only on words.

By starting this tread with very good and professional resulst. It show the way electrolysis has to be done.

Now. What we are waiting is the contribution of other electrologists or customers from other practionner who does marathons clearances. We expect clear pictures with the same lighting before and after. The lighting is very important. If you take a photography with the flash on or with the natural light. The density of the hair won't appears properly.

I want to give some advices BEFORE going to an electrologist. If you are a new customers and want you hair permanently removed with electrolysis, PLEASE, read what is crucial below. It will save you time, your money and I hope your anxiety.

1.Before starting a treatment with the "clear and wait" strategy. (3-4 clearances.) you HAVE TO let your hair untouched by any temporary method of hair removal( shaving, waxing, rubbing, depilatory cream etc.) for at least 4 months.

2. Before choosing and electrologist, ask pictures like the one above to this practionner. If the lighting is different in the before and after pictures, this is not a good sign to start with as it can hide the reality of what amount of hair is present and the skin condition. If the practionner refuse to provide photography spaced by month of clearances. It is not a good sign too.

Please note that photos took just after the treatment is not useful at all. It's like the practionner is proud of the hours spent on the table. I don't get it. The practionner HAVE TO be proud to show results like the pictures of the legs above. But displaying image of area during treatments or uncompleted ones is not a finality.

Ask the following questions:

How many clearances do I have to do to be 99% hair free

How many times is it going to take to have my area hair free ?

3. Book a 1 hour appointment with the practionner you feel confident with and who answered clearly the questions below and ask him/her to do a patch test on an untouched area. By patch test, I mean epilating ALL the hair in a little portion of the area you want you hairs gone forever. You don't have to feel a plucking sensation during the treatment.(IMPORTANT: a hair that realeade without any resistant is a very good sign. Although this is not a guarantee that the hairs has been definitely killed.) PLEASE wait 3 month and see if you see a reduction in hair density. If you see a lot of hairs that look shaved, this is not a good sign at all and that show that the practionner has a low kill rate and you won't be finish in 3-4 clearances. You have try another one. If you want to save time, maybe doing differents patch test with differents electrolosgist is not a bad idea.

4. Don't go to a professional only because another professional made an endorsement. Often this professionals didn't even meet each other and are online contacts. Keep in mind: a good reputation or being "famous" in electrolysis means nothing. (When you make an endorsement you have to be treated previously with succes by this practionner or you need to see former customers treated with succes.) seeing someone working for 2 hours during a pro to pro demonstration can indixate if someone is removing hair with resistance (which is not good.) but you CAN'T make an endorsement ONLY based on the speed and the ability of an electrolysis to remove hair without traction. The best thing you can say after seeing a professional working is that he/she is fast, removes hair without traction and uses the finger or tweeter method to remove the hair. "It looks not bad at all."

It can seems long before you start a treatment but it is the only way you will know if it's worth your money.

Posted by: Josefa M. Reina

Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! - 12/10/17 10:04 AM

Stomach and belly.


7 Months AFTER the last clearance:

Posted by: ingeileen1991

Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! - 12/10/17 10:25 AM

Originally Posted By Josefa M. Reina
Stomach and belly.


7 Months AFTER the last clearance:

Wow!! Amazing Josefa! How much work did you invest in this wonderful work (Number of clearance and hours invested)?
Posted by: Roselake21

Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! - 12/10/17 05:16 PM

Great work. Does this girl needed 3 or 4 clearances ?
Posted by: Roselake21

Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! - 12/15/17 10:25 AM

This really a shame that ONLY Josefa gave us the opportunity to see (again) her near perfect work...
Posted by: Josefa M. Reina

Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! - 12/16/17 08:39 AM

Originally Posted By Roselake21
Great work. Does this girl needed 3 or 4 clearances ?

95/99% of the hairs in all these cases of untouched hair are permanently removed in 3 clearings. Depending on the client's requirement, that remaining 5/1% is removed when the client comes for new areas.
Posted by: Josefa M. Reina

Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! - 12/16/17 08:47 AM

On the buttocks (Asian skin):

BEFORE. (July 2014)

7 months after the last clearance. (June 2016)

There was a lot of post-inflammatory hyperpigmentation in this area that had almost disappeared when the "After" photo was taken.
Posted by: Josefa M. Reina

Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! - 12/16/17 09:17 AM

About SCABS and post-treatment manifestations.

Many Hairtell users are very concerned about this issue. Reason why I want to show the following picture taken immediately after concluding the first clearing:

As you can see in the "After" pictures included in the first series of this thread, the scabs have not only disappeared, but her skin has considerably improved its initial appearance.
Posted by: Michael Bono

Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! - 12/16/17 10:26 AM

Excellent photos. There is nothing that gets our professional's "panties in a bunch" more than the subject of SCABS! (Not clients; electrologists themselves.)

When I was more "sharing" with our mini-minions, I was constantly denounced for "causing scabs." And, for body work, I do!

I've learned that there is nothing you can do, Josefa, to convince anybody of what is actually, normal, nominal and signs of a good treatment.

Sometimes we get into the "micrometer" discussion about what is the "appropriate scab size," but all of this is sort of silly. Still, the absolute horror I have seen on electrologist's faces when I show them my photos (like yours) is worthy of a Hollywood horror film.
Posted by: Josefa M. Reina

Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! - 12/16/17 06:08 PM

Yes, I know that this photo is going to unleash a feather storm and a lot of criticism from some of our colleagues. I counted on it.

20 years ago, the fear of criticism would have prevented me from uploading this photo. Nowadays the opinion of those experts, who are not causing scabs, I do not give a damn. I have promised myself to ignore any criticism that comes from someone who is not able to provide a single evidence of the results of his/her work.
I also want to see photos, before, during and after, of the treatments carried out by those electrologists who remove hair permanently without causing any kind of reaction.

I do not know if we will be able to convince someone of what is normal and expected, Mike, but at least, we are trying to normalize a side effect that inevitably occurs in body work.

If in this profession there had been more transparency and less misinformation, consumers in general would be less concerned about any insignificant cutaneous manifestation.
Posted by: Iluv2zap

Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! - 12/16/17 06:49 PM

sorry Josepha you wont get any criticism out of me for documenting treatment and healing.

I would say though that your photos dont tell the whole story ( in this one instance)

We have the before , the after, but nothing in the middle. It's the manifestations that we are not seeing here ( scabbing, angiogenesis, hyperpigmentation ) that compose the largest number of concerns for people.
Posted by: Josefa M. Reina

Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! - 12/16/17 07:13 PM

Hi Seana, I think you've overlooked the last picture of legs. There are thousands of scabs, one for each treated follicle. This shows scabbing, I'll look for one that talks about hyperpigmentation.

Keep in mind that I can only take pictures when the client comes to me, that is, after several months of treatment. What happens in the middle is beyond the reach of my camera.
Posted by: dfahey

Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! - 12/17/17 01:54 AM

I would personally welcome any of my clients to post pictures of their skin condition 48 hours after their session because that is when scabbing can show. Also, I strongly encourage anyone that I have treated and FINISHED years ago to post their before, middle and after results. If they can't do that, then describe for the folks here what the outcome was.

All I can truthfully say is some people scab on the face and some people don't. For the body, most people scab. All scabbing is short-lived and heals nicely. Same goes for angiogenesis and hyperpigmentation.

As for the uselessness of pictures taken right after a treatment, the purpose is not to show an end result, it is to educate others as to what the skin looks like immediately after a clearance so the consumer or neophyte electrologist can get a realistic understanding of what the skin will look like after hours of working to clear a face, a hairline, nipple area, legs, back, etc.

Someone noted above that taking pictures immediately following a treatment were useless, so I thought I would explain the purpose of taking pictures immediately after a clearance - something I frequently do, especially on the closed facebook sites, which I assume others new to electrolysis or to our profession, would find interesting, reassuring and helpful.
Posted by: Stephgold

Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! - 12/17/17 06:56 PM

Great pics! Does anyone have pics of faces before and after? Most women like me would like to see faces.
Posted by: Roselake21

Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! - 12/18/17 07:14 AM

Of course we see the scabs in the picture. The pictures tells the whole story. This is a story about permanent hair removal. Nothing else nothing more. Thank you Josefa!

Welcoming clients who are maybe not visiting hairtell to post pictures of their treatments is a good start. But as I said before, a professional like Josefa obtain the rights to post pictures of her customers while many other electrologist are writing ABOUT posting pictures. This is a big difference.

I think I wrote enough posts to the electrologist to understand that we now want to see photos and we are not anymore "ok" to read and understand the multiples reasons why you can't provide good quality photos.

I said that when you ONLY have post reaction pictures it is useless for customers of course.

We are going to post many photos of what the skin looks like just after the treatment. So people will understand, once for and for all "what a skin reaction looks like."

I want to ask a questions to the customers. What do you prefer when choosing an electrologist ? proof of his/her work ? The guarrantee that more than 99% of the hairs are killed after being treated ? Real customers who are now hair free ? (A very good electrologist won't hesitates to ask a former clients if he/she wants to show their results to the new client.)

Or do you prefer an electrologist who use WORDS most of the time but doesn't go straight to the points ( proof of his/her ability to remove hair permanently) ?

Think about that twice. You don't have to believe, you have to see photos, you have to do a patch test you have to figure out if it is worth you money and at the end of it, you start your treatment or you try another professional.

I prefer being upfront and saying what customers need and say the true about electrolysis permanent hair removal

Posted by: Michael Bono

Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! - 12/18/17 11:35 AM

Roselake, I hate being lectured to ... especially from someone who (unlike me) has not spent 40-years in this profession. Your postings are starting to sound like a harangue. Good ideas, mind you ... but consider that for every activity, there has to be a PAYOFF! Bottom line: the majority of electrologists are not going to take the time to organize and post photos because doing so is counter-productive! Bottom line: photos "convince" no clients, and predictably "piss off" other professionals.

You probably think that hundreds of therapists and clients read Hairtell ... not so, it's a scant hand-full. There is no "audience."

Photos never convince neurotic clients. You can show them, and even write to them "in blood," but if they insist something went wrong ... it's no use; you just have to wait it out.

Photos do not convince prospective clients. They assume the photos are fake, or doctored in Photoshop.

Specific photos that illustrate technique, modality and (especially) TTT, infuriate other electrologists. They assume you are "grand-standing" and trying to be "better than they are."

If clients themselves want to post photos, that would be fine. However, for myself, I'm tired of hitting myself over the head. (And, I know Josefa is too.) I have thrown away hundreds of photos and will only rarely post photos (or use them in an educational video).

I wonder, how many dentists or plastic surgeons post the types of photos you want to see? (The surgeon I work with doesn't even have a website.) Sure, maybe a scant few, but they have also learned that our practices are based on ONE patient at a time ... a real person.

In this age of "fake news" and "Photoshopped" images, what you are demanding to happen is not going to happen. While I agree with your sentiments, I think it's time to stop preaching.

Posted by: Michael Bono

Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! - 12/18/17 12:33 PM

Let me add that nearly all on-line photos and writings go into a sort-of "Black Hole." Data goes in and nothing is ever seen, or heard of, again. Sucked-up and GONE! Poof!

Since 1991, I have sold more than 6,000 books. My ideas about "anagen only" and "papilla as target" are there. Add to this Art Hinkel's 1968 book that is the mainstay of the industry ... with the same information. And yet, the electrology myths are perpetrated with unabated "pedagogical certitude."

Before & After photos are instantly relegated to the "Black Hole" (especially on Hairtell) ... and 10-minute videos (that can take 50-hours to produce) have little to no effect on anybody. Still, Josefa and I (add in Dee and Seana), will drudge on with this endeavor, because it's what we do. Four idiots!

However, I have learned in my 40-years, not to expect "continental shifts" in attitudes from a few plaintive posts on Hairtell. And, I don't!
Posted by: Roselake21

Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! - 12/18/17 01:10 PM

"A PAYOFF" for what activity ? Michael, I m maybe upfront but you are one of the electrologist who showed pictures of your work. This is very good. You are not lectured. My posts are addressed to everybody, not you. Sorry if I sounded like if I wanted to learn you electrolysis. It is obviously not the case at all.

This is not my opinion, photos help a lot and there is few people who think about photoshop when it comes to an experienced electrologist who presents pictures.

All the tread that has been created on hairtell are online and you can see them if you use google for an exemple. Google image helps a lot.

I have no interest in saying what i say apart informing new customers.

Electrologist who don't post pictures are maybe as great as the one who post pictures but we don't know.

I wanted to explain what I think would be good in term of explanations for customers in a good way but you are maybe true. People don't listen, don't make research on older posts.... at least I tried to explain my point of view and maybe it will help somepeople.

Posted by: Michael Bono

Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! - 12/18/17 02:37 PM

... and, I agree with you!

However, there is a reality that most electrologists understand. For those willing to show their work there is virtually no benefit ... NO PAYOFF ... to themselves or to clients.

If you produce something, the electrologist has to get some benefit. Electrologists have discovered (for the most part) that attempts to showcase their work can be destructive to them, i.e., lots of criticism from the profession. (Notice in Josefa's post she understood the "shit was coming.")

But ... sure ... I agree with your premise. I just know the reality of this hair removal industry. Your post will change nothing: I'm telling you how it is; not how it should be.

And sure "screw it!" I plan to continue showing electrolysis work with all the things lived learned over the decades. It's what I do.
Posted by: Michael Bono

Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! - 12/18/17 07:35 PM

I have to agree with you Josefa. See, we might illustrate what we are doing, but we have never told any electrologist that "this is the ONLY way." Indeed, I wrote a book called "the Blend Method" and it does explain the justification and theories behind the blend ... that does NOT therefore mean that I'm against any other modality (and I'm not). Yet, people assume that I am "bull-headed" on the subject.

As we repeat over-and-over there are many strategies. I say, here's one way ... and there are other ways and certainly I follow different strategies all the time. The big cases ... with the big results ... and the ones who follow the most aggressive strategy, get the job done relatively quickly and are the best photographic subjects.

But there is an "instant reaction" ... even from friendly electrologists ... who think if you say something specific, that means you are critical of whatever they are doing (and usually you don't know what they are doing).

If somebody says they use an insulated needle, that doesn't mean that my use of a non-insulated needle is wrong. That's not what they are saying; and that's not what I hear either.

I hope that "Roselake" now sees why most of us just "shut the f... up" and keep to ourselves; or just utter platitudes so as to not "piss off" other operators. It's just not worth it.
Posted by: Michael Bono

Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! - 12/18/17 09:35 PM

YES! There is some danger in the "electrolysis zealot" who has found "the holy grail!"

Years ago when I was doing a lot of work in Holland, a woman (Mrs. Rooperos) was so horrible in my lecture I asked her to leave. She was a zealot for some method that she insisted was the best ... she would not let me do my lecture and interrupted me constantly.

Anyway, she listened, got used to what I was teaching and THEN became a gigantic pain in the butt supporting my ideas. She went from one extreme to another, but her "pain in the assness" kept on going. Sometimes clients are like that: they find the "truth" and then everybody else is wrong.
Posted by: Michael Bono

Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! - 12/18/17 09:38 PM

There are no laser operators posting here ... and only a couple electrologists. This is a nice site, but it is not an educational site and never purported to be. It's like a gigantic "mixer" that ends in a "black hole." But folks probably get something out of it ... hope so.
Posted by: adrien_sanchiz

Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! - 12/21/17 11:08 AM

Nowadays in beauty industry we tend to provide before and after pictures. Why ? Because beauty industry have a very long history of scams. From radioactive face powder (1930”) to stem cells cream (nowadays).
It is the same for beauty technology : micro-current, galvanic mask lift... and now the new technology with invisible bioestimulation laser, “tsunami wave”....

I think all that stuff is fantastic, it does illustrate how creative we are and how passionate we are for treating and beautifying the skin.

I am currently working for a Spanish company as a trainer for beauty machine and electrolysis.

For our radiofrequency machine we provide pictures from the client himself. Moreover we teach how taking before and after pictures properly in order to be able to judge the results. (I am quite impressed by the radiofrequency technology by the way).

Before and after pictures is the key to convince our clients. We can repeat 1000 times we are the best, our machine is so unique, so powerful... in vain. Nowadays the consumer is more educated, he gets internet, he doesn’t want to get scammed and he is true !
This is the same for FUE surgery (for treating baldness). Now consumers WANT before and after pictures. In this field, for 100 surgeons, we have only 10 which are able to provide good pictures.
Are the others one bad surgeons ? Not at all. But the bad ones are not able to provide good results for sure.

HOWEVER for electrolysis field, it seems that this is all different. Thanks to the fathers of electrolysis (experienced in 1866 and 1875) we know electrolysis can permanently destroy superfluous hair.
The bad news are that these doctors from the 19 century did not take any pictures. Fortunately in theses cases, words was enough.
BUT electrolysis results depend only on the practicionner, not the machine.

Of course that is okay if no one want to take before and after picture, as it used to be in the 19th century. However, how to respond to all these people saying electrolysis does not work?

In French forum, (for example)!the big majority of testimonies says electrolysis does not work. Because they experimented with DOCTORS and they didn’t get results.
How can we convince them ? Saying that in 1866 and 1875 we get some medical littérature telling that it worked at this time ? Or repeating other and other again that the FDA said this is “permanent”? Well, it is what we are doing...

Consumers don’t care about doctors in the 19th century and this American organization called FDA. They want results ! Real results !

Going back to my work: we have pictures for our radiofrequency machine but none for electrolysis... I have mine in case if a client wondering...

Thus why electrolysis escapes to the norm for the beauty industry ? In surgery we have pictures, in plastic surgery we have pictures (more and more in scientific litterature they publish pictures too), in FUE surgery, in aesthetic procedure as Botox, fillers, radiofrequency and LASER we have pictures...

And electrologists, closed on their little world, don’t want to take and publish pictures... moreover they prefer to attack the one who published before and after pictures....

Meanwhile Mike Bono is still wondering in Facebook why people don’t know electrolysis...
Posted by: adrien_sanchiz

Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! - 12/21/17 01:04 PM

If you feel more comfortable to “stick to the FB groups”, good for you.
Posted by: Roselake21

Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! - 12/21/17 01:07 PM

You are responsible for your statements. Please don't drag me Into this EmancipatedElect. I have never said there is ONLY one correct strategy.
Posted by: Josefa M. Reina

Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! - 12/21/17 05:13 PM

For some strange reason that I can not understand, there is a certain rejection towards the comments or advice made by a Hairtell neophyte. Especially if he or she uses "too much" passion or enthusiasm. The same thing happened with Seana at the beginning. Fortunately, that stage was left behind.

Roselake21 (whose true identity I do not know) has made the serious "mistake" of advising consumers on how to obtain reliable evidence of the effectiveness of an electrolysis treatment. Something that, on the other hand, many users have repeated here ad nauseam. How many times have we read Michael Bono say: "Test the water before jumping into the pool!"?. The difference is that Michael is a recognized authority in electrology, while Roselake21 is a complete stranger.

I have to admit, EmancipatedElec, you're right. We both do not work in the same way if what you say on your website is correct:

"Under professional conditions, electrolysis is generally very safe with only minor temporary effects after treatment, such as some redness and swelling that should abate after a couple of hours.
Although the pain of electrolysis is subjective, generally speaking, the process will hurt less than tweezing, threading or waxing. It will hurt significantly less than laser. Most of the pain is caused by a disruption to the moisture in the skin and, in thermolysis, is generally over in an instant. Usually, you won’t feel much pain when removing the treated hair afterward."

The electrolysis that I perform is not intended to affect the dermal papilla, but rather the cells responsible for hair growth. My electrolysis hurts more than tweezing, threading or waxing, and usually it has side effects that last more than two hours. However, the client NEVER feels anything when the treated hair is removed.
Posted by: Michael Bono

Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! - 12/21/17 09:37 PM

I like this comment: " ... an overzealous consumer, ... has now gotten a bunch of electrologists "angry" with each other and defensive." I think this comment is cute ...

Here's my experience. An electrologist sees some of my work or hears from one of my former clients. THEN, she assumes that I MUST be doing something different, even strange (probably because my TTT is way different from hers?).

I'm now working on a client from Texas. I kid you not, his former electrologist told him that he must not come to me because I'm using some dangerous technique from AFRICA. She wasn't sure what it was, but just knew I was doing some sort of Voodoo.

People make assumption all the time. I used to argue and try to explain how mundane my treatments really are. Finally, I just gave up. And, of course, I REALLY AM USING VOODOO!

Truly, all the people in this little skirmish are people I REALLY REALLY like. So "kiss and make up." Let me be the first to give all of you (even Adrien) a great big Christmas kiss! SMACKAROO!
Posted by: hairy Harry

Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! - 12/27/17 08:10 PM

As a consumer I'm not going to be taking in by `before & after' photos, maybe before the internet I might have been, not now, as someone above said photos can be chopped.
Posted by: SecretSid

Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! - 02/12/18 04:56 PM

More pictures please?
Posted by: SoCalPurr

Re: Before & After electrolysis photos! - 02/13/18 01:10 PM,_Numbers,_Gra.html