Ok, So I went to lady #1 in my new search. She was much older than I expected but she was great to talk to. She did thermolysis on the Fischer advanced programable and it hurt a LOT lesss than the blend, I was surprised because my one microflash tx on the Apilus before, had hurt a lot more. And I also did not experience the dryness and itching I was getting with the blend! Can I be allergic to the lye??
I have to say that I was well hydrated and only decaf tea the whole day, thats very hard for me, I was yawning all day long.
We did a 15 min tx only, she use K3(or F3??) short stainless needles. She was willing to go with gold but since I had been using gold previously but getting the brown dots, I wanted to go with stainless only. She wiped the area with a topical anesthetic a few times during the tx and emu oil after. The area was a little swollen and pink after with the red dots that I usually don’t see until the next day. She said she went through 191 pulses, the thicker ones on the corners required two so its not a one to one hair count.
Well today morning the skin looked all full of brown dots but calmed down a bit after I applied witch hazel, followed by Neutrogen spf 55 sunblock. This afternoon I used witch hazel and pure aloe and I have the signature brown dots and some are still red, looks like I will get a few scabs.
So the biggest advantage I felt was the much reduced pain and no itching. I felt a few tugs in the beginning but nothing much after. She is also quite knowledgeable, except she insists her results with the finer probe are the best.
My biggest concern apart from the brown dots is whether she can see all the hair (she must be 70-75 yrs old, has glasses and attaches the magnifiers to it) and a little bit on the hygiene front, she doesn’t wear gloves (yes, she said they were more for her own protection and can feel skin better without) was touching my skin (and resting hand over my lips) a lot more to stretch etc than my other lady does. Also she has a brace on her foot and lives alone so I am just not sure how she could ensure everything stayed extra clean, although she assured me everything was sterilized well and she always washes hands in between.
oh, she said the magnification was a 5 when I asked and also she said that by spacing the time between the pulses, you can manage the heat distribution of the finer probe. It seemed like there was a lot of time between pulses.
Give her a chance and I’m glad that you hydrated and de-caffeinated yourself before a treatment. Oh, and gold probes are not the cause of hyperpigmentation. Some people have this response no matter what, but it can happen as a response to technique and tools used as well.
Stay in charge of your healing and work with her. She sounds easy to communicate with, which is a real bonus.
So what do you think about the lye question - can I be allergic to it? or can I be allergic to the gold needles - could they have been causing the itching and dryness…maybe I should try gold next time with this lady and see what happens…
I’m not certain that you are allergic to either. I’m especially sure you are not allergic to gold probes. If you want to be a little scientist along with your electrologist, and if she is willing, you can do one area of your face with blend and gold and one area with thermolysis and gold.
For now, just let her do her thing and if you heal well, then relax and keep going. If you are back to the same side effects, then maybe she will work on another strategy with you. Some of us are flexible and some of us think, “just lay down and be quiet and let me do my thing”. I hope she is the flexible kind.
Hi all! Haven’t updated in forever. I have been getting treatments on an Apilus by a very talkative friendly lady with great hygiene and professional magnification. I am going every 2 weeks (due to her schedule) for 30, 45 min or 1 hr; my growth is way less than before, but I have yet to get full clearance on my lower lip, the hairs are very short, thin and dark. My concern is that I experience tugging very close to plucking frequently, I smell burned hairs, I hear spark like pops. Txs are pretty painless, scabs are uncommon and are tiny dots that clear in 3-4 days.
I suspect that these real tiny hairs are hard to insert into and with all the talking, and my responding in my desire to keep this lady on friendly terms, I am doing myself a great disservice. My stupid question is how do I stop. She is very proud of her work and if I try to suggest that the talking maybe causing the pops and the tugging, she may get offended. she is very expensive for ca, I need to do something.
When someone is working on your mouth, you need to have YOUR mouth closed. HER talking on the other hand doesn’t change her accuracy as much as better magnification and lighting would.
Hert9;
It sounds to me as if your electrologist is using the Flash Modality. Am I correct. For flash to work, the tip of the probe, must be placed as close as possible to the papilla. It works by desication of all the moisture surrounding the tip. Thus, it heats the immediate area up to at least 212 deg. F. At this temperature, moisture quickly expands and more than likely the popping noise you are hearing is that moisture trying to make its way out the hair shaft with very little opening left for it to escape from.
A difficult case for flash to work is when the hairs are distorted. Ask your electrologist, what is going on with the hairs that feel like they are being tweezed. It could be that the hairs were a different depth then she expected, or the hairs could be distorted to where it is impossible to get the tip of the probe at the correct point.
A moving target does make it difficult to get a probe inserted at the correct angle. I will back off until my clients are finished talking before attempting to insert a probe.
James, initially when you meet someone new you converse, take an interest in each other’s day/life etc to establish a rapport, we go straight to the table so its very hard to do that before or after, she shoos me off promptly :). Its seems rude if you’re quiet when that person is expending all that energy on you. And now, we have the established rythm of conv, hard to break it. Anyway, I’ll have to solve that problem myself, maybe over time.
What do you think about the tugging(less today than other times, usually atleast a third of the removal feels like it), the spark-like popping(constant, with every zap) and the burning smell (this is infrequent).
Martha, yes she uses microflash or picoflash, not sure which, but definitely flash.I don’t know the setting, its low, and she has adjusted it in the past for me.
She is using an insulated probe TH3, she says she loves how it works with me. She does say that my skin is super moist and my follicles are real tight, so that jives with your explanation of the sparking sound. So I guess its ok then that I am hearing every zap like a zap ?
I think its a combination of the hairs being shallow so there is not much depth for the probe to go in anyway and then the talking ofcourse may be throwing off the insertions. I will ask her what she thinks about the hair depth/type of hair follicles we are dealing with, next time.
Sparking sounds and burning smell tells me that the insertions may be shallow and the intensity may be too high, however, you say this is an infrequent occurence and you are healing just fine, so I guess this isn’t such a problem after all. It is certainly not your desire to offend her, I understand, but you can still ask her about the sparking and burning smell all the same. Even though we electrologists try to make perfect insertions every single time, sometimes we are less than perfect. She sounds like she is only human like the rest of us. If this happens for even 20% of her insertions, and your skin was starting to look funky, then I would be more concerned for you.
The burning smell was just a couple times this last tx, I went after 3 wks instead of 2 (she was sick) so we did one hour (maybe 10 min spent on chin, but she didn’t want to work lower lip too long)
She explained that the pop/burst sounds is moisture trying to come out of the closed follicle (she says I have ‘no follicles’, meaning skin is closed tight); also that the hairs are very fine and Very shallow, plus I have v.sensitive skin. So no issue of curved or distorted follicles.
I had scabbed more last time, and she was very concerned so she lowered the setting, but that led to more of a pulling sensation on the lower lip. So its a catch 22, is she increases the settings, then I will scab, if she lowers then I feel the tugging. I scabbed less this time, I have red dots the next day (also a couple whiteheads), then they turn purple in another day and they are already gone today (u/l ones, still have some on chin) which is day 4 since tx.
The lower lip was still about 45 min from clearance so now I will be going in a week for 30 min instead of waiting 2 weeks. Maybe in 3-4 txs I am expecting we may get to first full clearance. I think I have done about 10 hrs so far (upper and lower lip, maybe 10% time spent on chin).
on the good news side, the upper lip looks clearer each time.
I can’t recall. Does your electrologist have a computerized epilator like an upper end Apilus or Sil-Tone VMC? Proper intensity with proper probe type can work well without plucking or scabbing for these hairs as long as the magnification and lighting are good as well. Energy levels can be controlled so treatment energy is just right for this delicate area. There is no Catch-22 when one has good tools and skill.
All else sounds good for you except for the challenging under lip. If she can’t handle this area, it would be better for her to work on areas she can handle.
Growth charts are only generalized guides, in other words, they are not very scientific because there are many things that affect an individuals hair growth.
Those hairs under the lip are ususally very shallow downy hair. All I have seen are growth chart with information for upper lip hairs. Here is some information from one particular chart:
Upper lip > percentage in resting stage 45%, which lasts 6 weeks > percentage in growing stage 55%, which lasts 16 weeks.
There are on average about 500 follicles per square inch :eek: .
So new dilemna - for the last 3 mths, have been scabbing on upper lip every time, getting progressively worse. We are now treating fine hairs only, there are almost no coarse hairs left at 9 mths since I started. The fine hairs are still plenty though.
I have communicated with electro and she says that she liked the bigger probe (insulated size 3) because the hairs release better and that they wouldn’t release as well with the smaller probe (insulated, size 2), although my hairs match the size 2. This is true, if you remember, I had been earlier concerned with a lot of tugging and popping.
There is still a lot of sparking, but much less tugging but I DO scab every time.
Is there something that can be done staying at the bigger probe to prevent the scabbing??
Also, surprised that we have done almost 20 hrs on this small are, and I think that I am still a few months away. The electrolgist is not slow, I just think I get more regrowth than I should.
The intensity may be to high. With an insulated probe, the energy needs to come down. These finer hairs are probably shallow. Shallow insertions are undesirable and can cause skin reactions like yours if the intensity is not turned down.
Are you getting hyperpigmentation? I can’t recall. Sizzling sounds? Please ask her to turn it down.
Hi Dee, yes I am pretty hyperpigmented, more on the side that is away from where she sits (my left) and has me turn my face as she works. But that is also the window side in the driver’s seat in the car, so maybe more about greater sun-exposure on that side. I do use a mositurizer with SPF.
I will feedback on the scabbing again and ask if there is a lower setting to still get releases.
What do you think about the probe size based on this reaction?
If your hairs are fine and she thinks the size 2 insulated matches these hairs, then you’ll have to trust her judgement. With insulated probe use the insertions really have to be super accurate. Not much room for error in hitting the target with these probes or you may have more regrwoth. My concern still lies with turning down the intensity, especially if a smaller size 2 insulated probe is being used. Sizzling sounds certainly give us that as a clue. (mmmmmm, makes me want a steak right now)
Talk to her about switching to a gold probe and adjusting the intensity, that is, if you feel she is approachable. Verbalize your concerns about hyperpig and scabbing. It can make her a better electrologist if she knows how you feel, hert.
Scabs are not necessary to achieve permanent hair removal via any modality of electrolysis. Both practitioner and client should always strive toward scabless healing on facial areas.
Back again with a question. Can very fine upper lip (and lower lip)hairs go ino telogen in 3.3 weeks(last tx, and I have been doing this upper lip since last april). We went back to a size 2 insulated probe because of the scabbing with the size 3. And yes I got less scabbing and smaller sized, but I could feel a lot of resistance in hairs being pulled (especially on lower lip), when I mentioned it, that was the reason provided. Is it possible?
It may be 3.3 weeks since the last treatment, but that doesn’t mean the hairs started their growth cycle 3.3 weeks ago. I don’t know if you have been getting full clearance or not, but this is one reason why full clearances are so important. By definition any hair you see within a certain time after full clearance is a growing hair, as it would not be visible otherwise.
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